A Minor Rant Re: Halloween

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A Minor Rant Re: Halloween

Postby The Gneech on Thu Oct 31, 2002 8:16 am

I get so sick of the never-ending assault on Halloween. Otherwise sane, sensible people who have no objections to Christmas or Easter are constantly trying to eradicate Halloween due to its "pagan" origins, and it burns me up.

A related idiot is the "Halloween Is Too Dangerous!" parent. If you are one of these people who complains about the degradation of the neighborhood as a social unit and the decay of communities in general, and then won't let your kids go trick-or-treating because you're afraid they might find a razorblade in their apple, then bend over, because you're due a serious butt-kicking. It's all YOUR fault.

As for "mall-o-ween," I don't even want to dignify it with comment, but if I don't, some fool will think I approve. I bear no malice towards the well-wishing shopping mall owners who initiated the concept, nor even malice towards the not-so-well-wishing shopping mall owners who see halloween as just another gimmick to get people's wallets in the door. But I do bear malice towards the scared-bunny parents who would take advantage of "mall-o-ween," on the grounds that it's somehow safer than walking your little tykes around to meet the people on your block and say, "Trick or treat!"

Honestly, people. 90% of the folks around you are wonderful, kind people who'd love nothing better than to meet their neighbors and rot the kiddies' teeth with prepackaged sugary goodness. Yeah, you've got to watch out for the other 10% ... but dammit, that's life! The world is not a safe place. But you've got to live in it anyway! And nobody's going to make it safer if you don't.

-The Gneech 8)

PS: I am dressed up like Dr. Who today. :) Happy Halloween, everybody!
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Postby TKarrde98 on Thu Oct 31, 2002 9:10 am

Well, Doctor. Let me tell ya, I'm not looking forward to Masked Monster Munchkin Mayhem this afternoon, because I will be the one dodging all the little critters as I deliver fresh, hot pizza. I, for one, think mall-o-ween is great-- it gets the kiddies out of my way and makes my job much easier.

Heh. Alas, I must leave my big, scary wig behind. *Sigh* Don't want to frighten the customers.

But I agree with you, that it's not because of the scary freaks out there that the kiddies should be careful. It's because of the cars... and the excuse to party hearty-- GAWD! If anyone drinks and drives tonight, I wish them a fast and violent death against the telephone pole before they harm anyone else.

Ok, before I get myself moderated, I had better stop, get my fingernails dried, and hop in the shower. I have much still to do before work.

Ciao, bello!

-=T "I'm not a Goth! I just look like one!" K
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Postby The Overseer on Thu Oct 31, 2002 11:10 am

He. Well, in Holland we don't celebrate Haloween. We do celebrate Sint Maarten, pretty similar. We do not dress like scary creatures and stuff, but we make "lampionnen" Euhm... basically, it's a thing made of paper. It's hollow, and inside you put a candle, or a lamp if you feel a candle is too risky. Then you go around the neigbourhood, and you ring the bell at everyone's door. You sing a song, and you get candy. And of course there are contests for the best song and the most beautifull lampion (you make it yourself.) But, that's only for the little kids.
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Sint Maarten

Postby Won-Tolla on Thu Oct 31, 2002 1:34 pm

Sounds a bit like the Norwegian tradition to "g
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Postby hbar98 on Thu Oct 31, 2002 1:35 pm

What I am wondering is: Where are the Halloween SJ picts? Where are the tigeress and lioness in their Japanese Schoolgirl outfits (or catsuits....rrraaarrwww).

Just kidding ;) ...you probably have a lot on your plate right now..

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Mallow what?

Postby Won-Tolla on Thu Oct 31, 2002 1:50 pm

The Gneech wrote:As for "mall-o-ween," I don't even want to dignify it with comment


Great, yet another "clever" substitute expression cooked up by someone who couldn't care less about the origin and meaning of the original term.
As presumably everyone with a two-digit IQ knows, it's not "hall o ween" but "hallow e'en" or All Hallow's Eve. So without he dashes "malloween" really means "All Mallow's Eve".
That is, the Night of the Hollyhock!!
How's that for absurd??

There was something similar on a (hopefully) local basis over here last year or so. Some "clever" parents thought they'd try to come up with an alternative to a tradition that didn't belong here in the first place. They somehow came up with the idea that instead of begging for candy the kids should sell "boller" (buns) to raise money for some worthy cause. The name of this strange variant? BOLLOWEEN!

Which is about as silly as celebrating an alternative Christmas by selling homemade juice and calling it Crushmas. :P
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Postby The Gneech on Thu Oct 31, 2002 4:20 pm

hbar98 wrote:What I am wondering is: Where are the Halloween SJ picts? Where are the tigeress and lioness in their Japanese Schoolgirl outfits (or catsuits....rrraaarrwww).

Just kidding ;) ...you probably have a lot on your plate right now..

hbar98


If I put them on the to-do list now, I might be able to get them done by next Halloween...

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Postby Safarani on Thu Oct 31, 2002 5:40 pm

Hallowe'en used to be great. Go out and get tons of candy and get to dress up and maybe stay out later than usual.

Of course a parent was always with us when we were out. Until I was old enough, then I took my sister around myself. But that was back in the day and my parents were... what's the word that noone knows anymore... oh yea, responsible.

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Postby Safarani on Thu Oct 31, 2002 5:43 pm

Hallowe'en used to be great. Go out and get tons of candy and get to dress up and maybe stay out later than usual.

Of course a parent was always with us when we were out. Until I was old enough, then I took my sister around myself. But that was back in the day and my parents were... what's the word that noone knows anymore... oh yea, responsible.

Simple rule: don't eat anything that's not machine-wrapped unless you trust the person 100%.

As for Mall-o-ween I'd love to smack any idiot who takes their kids there. Oy. Same for anyone who goes out and buys their kid an expensive costume every year. My mom made my costume, or I came up with something myself. Sometimes we bought one if there was no time but it was just a cheezy $5 something and I added onto it myself.

Then again, aren't all holidays commercialized now? =P

Now that I'm older, Hallowe'en is just another excuse to goto the bar and get drunk and stupid and party until I pass out. This year, unfortunately, I have a midterm Nov 1 and since I'm in the city now I have no friends so no partying for me.

Personally I'd rather me out fufilling the pagan rituals, worshipping satan and stuff like that. Having grown up in a very religious area (not going to church myself, ever) I always try to freak the neighbours out somehow anyways =)

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Postby Fallwind on Thu Oct 31, 2002 8:01 pm

set time(to.get.up) = 6:30;
set time(go.to.sleep) = 23:30;
time(current) = 22:55;

if (time(go.to.sleep) - time(current) < time(needed.to.party) ) {
set action(watch.TV);
set action(go.to.bed);
}

else{
set action(party!);
}

set mutter = grumble;
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Postby Phantom Snowcat on Fri Nov 01, 2002 7:06 am

The Gneech wrote:
hbar98 wrote:What I am wondering is: Where are the Halloween SJ picts? Where are the tigeress and lioness in their Japanese Schoolgirl outfits (or catsuits....rrraaarrwww).

Just kidding ;) ...you probably have a lot on your plate right now..

hbar98


If I put them on the to-do list now, I might be able to get them done by next Halloween...

-The Gneech <-- is lame :roll:


Send me some work to do buddy, ill get it done asap =D

-always wants to help
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Re: Sint Maarten

Postby TKarrde98 on Fri Nov 01, 2002 9:45 am

Won-Tolla wrote:I did some "research" with a Norwegian search engine and found that the reason for the name is that in the old days adults used to dress up as animals (including at least one goat in each group) and go visiting their neighbours before Christmas.

We have a similar tradition, though there is no dressing up, except for warm coats, etc. People might take candles with them, and all go out and sing carols. Often the closing carol in front of someone's house is "We wish you a merry Christmas," to which the last verses are a request for food:

"Now bring us some figgy pudding,
now bring us some figgy pudding,
now bring us some figgy pudding,
And bring some right here!

We won't go until we get some
we won't go until we get some
we won't go until we get some
so bring it right now!"

Usually, though, Carollers are greeted with perhaps hot chocolate and candy canes, if the house is prepared for them.

Nowadays it's the kids who dress up (not as animals, well mostly not) and go visiting friends and relatives during the "romjul" (week between Christmas and New Year).

So if there were a Trekkie who absolutely lived for that time of year, would that make them a romjulan? Hee hee!

*Ducks and runs*

As for Halloween, we don't celebrate that here in Norway either - or at least didn't until a few years ago. Then someone made yet another try at uprooting a foreign tradition from its native soil and transplanting it to Norway.

Actually, Halloween comes from the superstitions on the Continent. It's a cross between Medieval Christianity and the descendant pagan religions from Druidic mythology. The druids celebrated a harvest festival, which over time began to involve the invoking of spirits. The Christians, in response to this, made All-Saint's Day (All's Hallowed Day), when the Saints were especially powerful in the world. Thus, in a world run by Christendom, All's Hallowed Eve was the day that the (evil) dead would rise and wander about, invoked by druidic spells, and would perform nasty deeds to those who did not give them treats to bribe them away. Then the world would be purged of their presence by the Holy Saints on November 1.

The first such try was about a decade (?) ago, when someone who had spent too much time in Rio thought introducing the carnival to Norway was a good idea. Sadly, it ended up as just another excuse to get drunk and make an ass of oneself.

That's about what Carnival is about. Mardi Gras usually falls on a Monday or the infamous Fat Tuesday, when everyone goes out and binges all their bad habits and raucous lifestyle before the coming fast, which begins on the Wednesday following Mardi Gras. Ash Wednesday is the start of the Lenten fast, when everyone is to do away with their sinful ways in preparation for Resurrection Sunday (convinently placed on Easter, the Sunday after the first full moon after the Spring Equonox).

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Postby Grendelwulf on Fri Nov 01, 2002 5:04 pm

I'm glad I got to go trick or treating this year. Mmmm... sweet delectables... ^_^. I wore my usual wolf mask... on the top of my head cause I can't breathe with it on. I think I'm going to be doing this well into my 40's :).

As for mall o ween... I haven't actually seen it but it sounds pretty stupid to me. Why did they have to @#@# such a cool holiday?

Oh, and parents making kids wear coats over their costumes, what's up with that? ;)
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Postby TKarrde98 on Fri Nov 01, 2002 10:50 pm

Hmm.... We only trick-or-treated once in a mall, because it was soooooo cold outside. It was horrible! All the shops gave away the exact same thing: bubble gum. I HATE gum!

-=TK
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Postby Phantom Snowcat on Fri Nov 01, 2002 11:14 pm

I dont! Gimme the gum!! (spits out my 3 day old spearmint) I need a refill ;)
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Re: Sint Maarten

Postby LevelHead on Sat Nov 02, 2002 6:12 pm

TKarrde98 wrote:We have a similar tradition, though there is no dressing up, except for warm coats, etc. People might take candles with them, and all go out and sing carols. Often the closing carol in front of someone's house is "We wish you a merry Christmas," to which the last verses are a request for food...
An old traditional piece sung by Peter, Paul and Mary described Olde England's version of "trick or treat". They do this at Christmas-time, and ask for food.

During the All Soals Day festiviles, poor people would beg for food and families would give them pastries called soal cakes in return for their promise to pray for the families dead relatives. This was encouraged by the church because it replaced the leaving of food and wine for roaming spirts. "Going-a-soaling" was later replaced by children visiting neighborhood houses and receiving food and money." The custom is called "Wassailing", and the song is called "A'Soalin'":
Hey ho, nobody home, meat nor drink nor money have I none.
Yet shall we be merry, Hey ho, nobody home.
Hey ho, nobody home, Meat nor drink nor money have I none.
Yet shall we be merry, Hey ho, nobody home.
Hey Ho, nobody home.

Soal, a soal, a soal cake, please good missus a soul cake.
An apple, a pear, a plum, a cherry,
any good thing to make us all merry,
One for Peter, two for Paul, three for Him who made us all.

God bless the master of this house, and the mistress also.
And all the little children that round your table grow.
The cattle in your stable and the dog by your front door.
And all that dwell within your gates
we wish you ten times more.

Soal, a soal, a soal cake, please good missus a soul cake.
An apple, a pear, a plum, a cherry,
any good thing to make us all merry,
One for Peter, two for Paul, three for Him who made us all.

Go down into the cellar and see what you can find.
If the barrels are not empty we hope you will be kind.
We hope you will be kind with your apple and strawber'
For we'll come no more a 'soalin' till this time next year.

Soal, a soal, a soal cake, please good missus a soul cake.
An apple, a pear, a plum, a cherry,
any good thing to make us all merry,
One for Peter, two for Paul, three for Him who made us all.

The streets are very dirty, my shoes are very thin.
I have a little pocket to put a penny in.
If you haven't got a penny, a ha' penny will do.
If you haven't got a ha' penny then God bless you.

Soal, a soal, a soal cake, please good missus a soul cake.
An apple, a pear, a plum, a cherry,
any good thing to make us all merry,
One for Peter, two for Paul, three for Him who made us all.

Now to the Lord sing praises all you within this place,
And with true love and brotherhood each other now embrace.
This holy tide of Christmas of beauty and of grace,
Oh tidings of comfort and joy.
===|==============/ Level Head
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Postby The Overseer on Sun Nov 03, 2002 1:48 pm

LevelHead, I don't know why, but somehow I really like you :D
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Postby LevelHead on Sun Nov 03, 2002 2:35 pm

The Overseer wrote:LevelHead, I don't know why, but somehow I really like you :D
Well, thank you. All I have done here is quote some song lyrics; though most of my poetic attempts are conjured on the spot, this piece is an old one and certainly not mine!

We've encountered each other on a few forums. I've attempted to follow your signature file's suggestion and "check out" that URL -- but I have not been successful. As I recall, the main website belongs to an England-to-US transplant named, apparently, Raven Black. Somehow, I don't think that this is you; it seems unlikely that the person in question would use a non-corvine avatar. ;)

What would I have seen had the link been working?
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Postby The Overseer on Mon Nov 04, 2002 6:14 am

He. Too be honest, you didn't miss much. In fact, I'll change that as soon as I have posted this... It brings you to a site from someone I don't know. There you can enter your name, and then I euhm... bite you, and you become a vampire. You can then earn points by luring others to that site, where you will bite THEM, and they become vampires. So that's what I was trying to do here... luring you there so I could get some extra points... Like I said, nothing special :p. Well, I'll go change it right away.
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Postby Wildfox on Mon Nov 04, 2002 6:51 am

1) Kudos to Gneech for dressing up as the good Doctor. I am guessing that you did the Tom Baker version. Considering you have the hat for it. :)

2) I think it is fair to say we all like Level Head. I find him very level headed ;). He has shown to be very insightfull of the human condition. A far wiser man then myself. As well as a smart and learned individual.

3. Malloween? Hmmmm. Don't knock it totaly. I am not sure I like the idea but I can't dismiss the idea myself. I am traditional in the sense that I would rather take any children I may have to the neighboring communties for trick or treating the way I had done it when I was a young boy. (I still have the scarf my mom made for me as a certain Doctor costume.) :)

4) I find it interesting that we have people who look up the history of customs of the past. You have taught me something new about our past. Thank you!!!
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Cold, cold, cold!

Postby TKarrde98 on Mon Nov 04, 2002 11:42 am

LevelHead wrote:An old traditional piece sung by Peter, Paul and Mary described Olde England's version of "trick or treat". They do this at Christmas-time, and ask for food.

During the All Soals Day festiviles, poor people would beg for food and families would give them pastries called soal cakes in return for their promise to pray for the families dead relatives. This was encouraged by the church because it replaced the leaving of food and wine for roaming spirts. "Going-a-soaling" was later replaced by children visiting neighborhood houses and receiving food and money." The custom is called "Wassailing", and the song is called "A'Soalin'":

Ah-HA! So that's what it means!

0/~
Here we come a carolling among the leaves so green!
Here we come a wand'ring so fair to be seen!
Love and joy come to you, and to you your wassails, too,
And God bless you and bring you a happy new year!
And God bring you a happy new year!
0/~

Thanks, LH! :)

Anyone know where the tradition of hay-rides came from? (Particularly since the wagons are usually loaded down with straw?

-=TK
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