I hate Aggie

The teenage years. Friendships, crushes, growth... and hating. Lots of hating.

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Postby oddtail on Sat Sep 09, 2006 3:25 am

JackFairy wrote:And yes, again, being white, I am very, very prejudiced against whites. Very. I just hate all white people because, being white, I know that all whites are entirely, exactly the same.


OK, I smell trolling here.

No, seriously.

But I'll go with the temptation, and write about it (but only once): if anyone can *ever* show me one trait of personality/flaw/virtue that is common for all white people, or even a vast majority of them... that'd be interesting. To say nothing about the idea that "all whites are the same". I mean, they are. Much in the same way that all humans are the same. But not an inch more than that.

Maybe what you meant is that all the white people *you* know, or where *you* live are the same. That's hardly proof for anything. It just shows that your frame of reference is narrow at best.
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Postby Sebastian on Sat Sep 09, 2006 4:07 am

oddtail wrote:
JackFairy wrote:And yes, again, being white, I am very, very prejudiced against whites. Very. I just hate all white people because, being white, I know that all whites are entirely, exactly the same.


OK, I smell trolling here.

No, seriously.


No, I think that was just sarcasm, but sometime is hard to say.
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Postby iRobot on Sat Sep 09, 2006 4:32 am

oddtail wrote:But I'll go with the temptation, and write about it (but only once): if anyone can *ever* show me one trait of personality/flaw/virtue that is common for all white people, or even a vast majority of them... that'd be interesting. To say nothing about the idea that "all whites are the same". I mean, they are. Much in the same way that all humans are the same. But not an inch more than that.


Besides, what constitutes "white people?" Where do you draw the line--the line has been redrawn so many times that it's rather confusing. At one point, Irish and Italian weren't considered "white." Even today, "hispanics" aren't considered "white" even though many have a lot of physical characteristics of "whiteness." Also, in a mixed race person--how much of their ancestory must be "white" for them to be considered "white."

Whatever. Does it matter? It's all stupid. If somebody's going to judge another person, they should at least have the decency to judge said person based on that person's individual motives, words and deeds.
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Postby Ollie_Vera on Sat Sep 09, 2006 9:03 am

Sebastian wrote:
oddtail wrote:
JackFairy wrote:And yes, again, being white, I am very, very prejudiced against whites. Very. I just hate all white people because, being white, I know that all whites are entirely, exactly the same.


OK, I smell trolling here.

No, seriously.


No, I think that was just sarcasm, but sometime is hard to say.

Uh, how is it NOT blatantly obvious too you all that he's joking? :-?
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Postby oddtail on Sat Sep 09, 2006 9:18 am

Ollie_Vera --> I've seen things like that being said un-jokingly. I used to assume that you can't say something like that seriously, but then I got corrupted ;).

But yeah, I didn't see the apparent sarcasm. Oh well.

Coming back to the point of the discussion: no-one mentioned Nick among the characters they don't like, yet. Not without reason, too - he's a little goofy at times, but so far he's been shown in the best light possible. Maybe it's a good idea for the strip to show him a little more close-up, then? ;) Seeing as one of the most wonderful things about the strip is the lack of "bad guys, good guys" distinction...
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Postby Aris Katsaris on Sat Sep 09, 2006 4:47 pm

How nice for you! You have that luxury.


I don't find ignorance to be a "luxury", so it would have been polite if you'd informed me of what "white" and "black" value systems are supposed to be like.

As a sidenote, I'd wonder the same if some Greek told me of some supposed difference between Greek and Albanian "value systems" (speaking of my own country's oppressed underclass).

And yes, again, being white, I am very, very prejudiced against whites.


I didn't accuse you of racial prejudice. I accused you of racial trollery.

P.S. Since when is voicing the fact that we live in a culture which is saturated with racism "racial trollery"?


You didn't voice *that* fact. You voiced a different claim, then you pretended that everyone should have figured that you meant something other than what you actually stated, reconfiguring the meaning of your words every time someone found an inaccuracy or fault at something you said, in the end pretty much claiming that the only thing you ever stated was that there's racism out there.

Trollery.

The *supposed* content of your words (i.e. not what you actually said, but what you *later* claimed to have said) is worthy of further discussion.
E.g. I'd argue that racist tactics are just as likely to want a subculture to *retain* their cultural characteristics and prevent integration, as they are to want it to to integrate: It depends on whether such bigotry mostly originates from xenophobia directed against other cultures or against alien genes.

Again making an analogy with the Greek/Albanian relations, there were Greek bigots that hated if Albanian would lift the Albanian flag to celebrate their own national team's victory against the Greeks -- but there also existed Greek bigots that hated if Albanians lifted the *Greek* flag to celebrate *Greece's* European championship also.

Assimilation of a culture is no more vile a tool in bigot hand than isolation/ghettoization of a culture is. Indeed I'd call it *less* vile, because assimilation can go both ways -- you get things like Eminem rapping.

But all this discussion is futile, unless you also start debating in an honest fashion -- that means things like:
a) speaking what you mean, and meaning what you speak
b) not playing the "am white too!" card to justify sweeping generalisations against whites
c) not pretending that those who objected to your words, actually objected to what you would *later* claim to mean
d) not playing the "am I supposed to such-and-such" tactics, when nobody suggested you should do any such-and-such thing.
e) not pretending that everyone that doesn't agree with you must be blinded because of privilege.
f) When someone says they don't understand what you mean by such-and-such, you *explain* such-and-such, instead of doing the condenscending "that must be nice" tactics.

When you descend to such tactics, no discussion can take place.
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Postby quitejaded on Sat Sep 09, 2006 6:31 pm

lol, oh you crazy white people. :3

I did catch something. Someone using the fact that their white to make what they said okay. Do you realize that's just as bad as being negro and saying "Hey, I can SAY NIGGER because I'm BLACK!"? Don't be ashamed of what you said and try to excuse it.

And one more thing -- Generalisations. Sorry to burst some of yalls bubbles, but generalisations are exactly that. GENERALISATIONS. There are ALWAY exceptions! Listen, your posts are long enough as it is. I'd rather you guys keep it in the practical generalisation mode. Hah
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Postby Ollie_Vera on Sat Sep 09, 2006 9:43 pm

quitejaded wrote:I did catch something. Someone using the fact that their white to make what they said okay. Do you realize that's just as bad as being negro and saying "Hey, I can SAY NIGGER because I'm BLACK!"?

It'd be bad only if it wasn't totally true.

Shit, I can't even THINK of the word without mentally slapping myself. I'd sit with black kids in my class and talk with them, and they'd call each other (and sometimes me :P) "nigga", but I would never want to risk saying the word back, especially if they're not close friends.

A comedian I once watched on Comedy Central was talking about how this one time, he and 2 other guys were sitting on the subway, and a black guy tried to get in but the doors kept closing on him so he either got stuck or just couldn't figure it out. Regardless, the driver/conductor got annoyed and came by to tell him to hurry up and sit down, and the black guy starts yelling, "You wouldn't be saying that to those CRACKAS over there!" After the third or fourth time of calling the three white guys "crackas", they all look at each other and think, "Shouldn't we be offended by now?"

I've found in a fair deal of places black people can say whatever they want to each other about whoever, in particular about whites. But what they say about themselves is not the business of anyone who ain't black. :-?
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Postby Yuko no Slayer-Dryad on Sun Sep 10, 2006 8:03 am

JackFairy wrote:
Aris Katsaris wrote:I have no idea what a "white" value system is supposed to be like.


How nice for you! You have that luxury.

And yes, again, being white, I am very, very prejudiced against whites. Very. I just hate all white people because, being white, I know that all whites are entirely, exactly the same.

P.S. Since when is voicing the fact that we live in a culture which is saturated with racism "racial trollery"? Am I supposed to pretend that everything's lovely and everyone's colorblind?

P.P.S. Sassy-fras, what you said about your ex's family was very interesting. I guess you didn't match their expectations or something, and that made them uncomfortable. Too bad for them. Thanks for that example. :-)

P.P.P.S. Rcmonroe--Sorry if you thought my original post implied that I think every single individual white person wishes people of color to abandon their culture. Though honestly, I still don't see how it could be read like that.


Amen! Why does this board attract PC Police like the MT board attracts unstable dorks?
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Re: My two cents....

Postby Richter on Sun Sep 10, 2006 9:02 am

Sassy-fras wrote:I have to say, after reading this topic I was left...well, feeling like I'm on an island of my own. As much as I love P&A, I don't think I put as much emphasis on which character I like more and why. I kind of appreciate every character and what they add to the story. It's an entertaining formula that, I think, if I hated one character more than another...I might lose the fun. So no, I don't particularly "hate" any character. There are some characters I can relate to more.

You're not entirely alone. :)

JackFairy wrote:Since when is voicing the fact that we live in a culture which is saturated with racism "racial trollery"? Am I supposed to pretend that everything's lovely and everyone's colorblind?

Nope, but generalising all whites and claiming 'they' want to do something bad isn't any different from saying the same, 'white' being exchanged for whatever ethnicity you choose. You know who you remind me of? Your hair isn't dyed blue, is it?

JackFairy wrote:Thus the way white Americans speak is "proper English,"

Erhm ... since when do Americans - ANY Americans of any size, colour or socioeconomic background - speak 'proper' English? I thought only British nobles did. Some of them. ;) Besides, which American whites are you talking about? Louisianans? Floridans? New Yorkers? Texans? Californians? Canadians? Germans? Andorrans? Hunh? Care to elaborate?
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Postby StarKruzr on Sun Sep 10, 2006 10:33 am

I have seen time and again the phenomenon of people being criticized because they don't fit into the culture that generally accompanies their race. Whites who are into rap and "thugg lyfe" and all of that are derided as "wiggers." Blacks who want to work hard and get good educations instead of making easy money by "hustlin'" get called Oreos -- especially if they don't "sound black."

It's a real phenomenon.
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Postby Sebastian on Mon Sep 11, 2006 3:58 am

Ollie_Vera wrote:
Sebastian wrote:
oddtail wrote:
JackFairy wrote:And yes, again, being white, I am very, very prejudiced against whites. Very. I just hate all white people because, being white, I know that all whites are entirely, exactly the same.


OK, I smell trolling here.

No, seriously.


No, I think that was just sarcasm, but sometime is hard to say.

Uh, how is it NOT blatantly obvious too you all that he's joking? :-?


I'm 99.9% sure he is joking, but sarcasm don't pass well on the internet.
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Postby kash on Mon Sep 11, 2006 6:18 am

I'm putting in my two cents that it was sarcasm, but a :roll: would have been helpful here.
that or a :lol: :wink: :-|, or :smug:
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Postby oddtail on Mon Sep 11, 2006 7:29 am

Um, but I *do* think I missed quite obvious sarcasm there. :grumble:

Let's drop the subject, shall we? I feel stupid enough as is :wink: .
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Dang, I've missed so much...

Postby Sassy-fras on Mon Sep 11, 2006 7:30 am

First, some off topic things I need to get out of my brain....

Stannish, I LOVE your avatar! LOVE IT! Especially since one can tell Radcliffe is giggling. Also, where's your quote from? It's strangely familiar.

iRobot, love your avatar too. It reminds me how confused I was when I saw it on Stand Alone Complex for the first time.

Slightly back to the topic...

Richter, thanks for joining me on my island. Care for a Pina Colada? Strawberry Daiquiri(sp?)? Smores? lol.

JackFairyP.P.S. Sassy-fras, what you said about your ex's family was very interesting. I guess you didn't match their expectations or something, and that made them uncomfortable. Too bad for them. Thanks for that example.


Thanks for that. I'll admit, after the break up, I was left with this huge insecurity about being disliked because of my race. Thankfully I met a guy with a great family that accepts me just the way I am.

RichterErhm ... since when do Americans - ANY Americans of any size, colour or socioeconomic background - speak 'proper' English? I thought only British nobles did. Some of them. Besides, which American whites are you talking about? Louisianans? Floridans? New Yorkers? Texans? Californians? Canadians? Germans? Andorrans? Hunh? Care to elaborate?


I found this interesting. It reminded me of a class I took in college. I had to fulfill my language credits, so I signed up for Spanish thinking it'd be an easy grade. (Boy was I wrong!) The class turned out to be the equivalent of your typical English Lit class in high school. Only difference was, everything was in Spanish!!! O_O (***Notes English is her first language and is bad at writing it!) Another girl and myself were the only ones that had retained Spanish as a second language. Everyone else came from another country where Spanish was their first. Anyway, my point ('cause I went way off on a tangent there!)... I remember at one point the professor stated that "proper" Spanish is spoken in Spain, and the other dialects were "informal". I thought "Hey...it's like America and England...but Spanish." Okay...I'm done looking dorky. :nervous: *skitters away!*

Edit::"(***Notes English is her first language and is bad at writing it!)" I mean I'm bad writing in Spanish...not English. >< Then again....lol. Dang nerdish need to correct my grammar!
Last edited by Sassy-fras on Tue Sep 12, 2006 9:22 am, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: My two cents....

Postby quitejaded on Mon Sep 11, 2006 3:36 pm

Richter wrote:
JackFairy wrote:Thus the way white Americans speak is "proper English,"

Erhm ... since when do Americans - ANY Americans of any size, colour or socioeconomic background - speak 'proper' English? I thought only British nobles did. Some of them. ;) Besides, which American whites are you talking about? Louisianans? Floridans? New Yorkers? Texans? Californians? Canadians? Germans? Andorrans? Hunh? Care to elaborate?


All of 'em. DUH!

Are you, like, blind? You're trying to remove race as an issue when it's ALWAYS BEEN AN ISSUE.

Continue with the brawl. :D
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Just to finish this off

Postby JackFairy on Mon Sep 11, 2006 8:53 pm

Good God, no-one ever seems to get when I'm joking here.

Also, I'm not male, thanks for making that assumption.

But to finally clear some things up:

1. Yeah, I'm white, but I'm not saying being white would make it okay for me to hate whites if I in fact did so--I'm just saying I think it's funny how everyone was so sure I was saying all whites are ONE WAY when, considering that I'm white and was critical of what I said "all" whites felt, I'm very aware that there's no such thing as a universal "white" standpoint.

2. That said, I still stand by the basic truth of my assertion, nor am I ashamed of voicing it. Come on, if you're white, would you complain about someone else acting too assimilated? (As opposed to joking about someone being "the whitest black person they know," etc.)

A person here did provide me with a counter example, so there, we have the exception that proves the rule, but in general--would you mind that someone speaks too much like you do, likes the same things you do, acts in ways that you are familiar with, etc? My original post was provoked by the fact that I thought it was funny that someone said that it was "disturbing" that it's mainly within the black community that black people are accused of acting too white. Of course that's where it would occur! People in general are distrustful of difference, not sameness. So of course white people wouldn't complain about people of other races who choose to act in ways that diminish the threatening difference, while as people from that culture would feel such persons are "selling out."

3. As such, my original post was meant to be humorous in tone, although it was dark or bitter humor. Yes, it was critical of white culture and the pressure it puts on others to conform or be left in the ghetto or stuck in lower-class jobs. But, considering the context and all that, I really think it was obvious (as I said before) that by "whites want..." I meant "mainstream white culture" or even better, "the institution of whiteness." I don't think I ever backed off from what I said--it just so happened what I said had several dimensions.

4. So no, I never meant "all whites ever, especially YOU, you honky racist." And I do think that if you're white and you are self-aware and anti-racist, you shouldn't get all whiny about obvious oversimplified generalizations, because of course they don't include "you." That strikes me as pointless as taking a class on feminism, and each time a statement is made about how men have treated and generally continue to treat women, someone would raise a hand and cry, "Well, I don't do that!" No, you don't--but the point of fact is, a huge number of others do.

5. Ignorance often is in fact a luxury. It's the same luxury as innocence.

6. When I said that the way white Americans speak English is considred "proper" English, come on, you all know what I meant. Yes, the "most proper" English is British English, and honestly, even that is a BS definition. But in the States, a general midwestern (ie, flat) accent is considered the most "proper." That's the accent that is "no accent"--the one in which newscasters, etc speak. It's the one that's considered to sound "well-educated," while as a Texan or Southern or a New Jersey accent won't get you the same reaction.

7. I was being sarcastic about 80% of the time here. Just letting y'all know.

8. My hair is dyed black.

9. I don't actually hate anyone.

10. I think that covered most of it.
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Re: Just to finish this off

Postby oddtail on Tue Sep 12, 2006 12:13 am

JackFairy wrote:Yes, the "most proper" English is British English


As a student of Linguistics (more precisely of English, actually), I must protest.

It's a TERRIBLY silly misconception that British English is "more proper", more correct, or stuff like that. Let me make myself clear: in *no* language, there is absolutely *no* dialect that is more proper or correct than any other (mind you, slang is not a full-blown dialect). Yes, there can be one dialect that enjoys the "official" status if one dialect is the sole literary language used. But it's true for languages that are used in one particular area (my native tongue, Polish, is a good example), and as such didn't develop so many regional dialects.

Specifically, American English is not in ANY way better, more correct or even more standard than British English, or Australian English for that matter (yes, same goes for, I don't know, Indian English (*), thanks for asking). The idea that BE is "more something" is crazy and was dropped around the middle of the XXth century. American English, having valid and numerous representations in culture (most notably literature), can in no way be considered an inferior, corrupted or otherwise "worse" version of English.

The only factor that distinguishes "proper" language from "not-so-proper" is the Native Speaker vs. Non-Native Speaker distinction.

Oh, and by the way: there seems to be a conception that there *is* some kind of generic "British English". It's absolutely untrue. British English is MUCH more varied than American English, as far as dialects go. If you don't believe me, listen to an Irishman, a Scotsman, or even (if you want to settle for England only) to someone speaking with a Yorkshire or Kent accent. The only dialect of British English that was *ever* considered "more proper" is Received Pronunciation (formerly known as "BBC English"), but the idea that this is "generic", "universal" or "proper" was dropped a long time ago. In fact, virtually no native English speakers use this dialect nowadays, anyway.

Sorry for straying from the topic, and sorry for making it sound like a lecture, but what I quoted at the beginning of the paragraph is a *very* common misconception. Let me say it again: generic AE is in all ways and manners (including the social status of a speaker, which is not always true for two dialects of a language!) equal to generic BE.

And before someone claims that BE is "purer" - William Shakespeare spoke a dialect that was *much* closer to today's American English than today's British English ;).

(*) by which I mean, "English spoken in India".
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Postby Richter on Tue Sep 12, 2006 5:50 am

So no, I never meant "all whites ever, especially YOU, you honky racist." And I do think that if you're white and you are self-aware and anti-racist, you shouldn't get all whiny about obvious oversimplified generalizations, because of course they don't include "you." That strikes me as pointless as taking a class on feminism, and each time a statement is made about how men have treated and generally continue to treat women, someone would raise a hand and cry, "Well, I don't do that!" No, you don't--but the point of fact is, a huge number of others do.


When I said "Nigger culture is crime and drug abuse", I never meant "All Blacks, especially you, Ghetto whore, do drugs , rape cheerleaders and mug grannies". And I do think if you're black, self-aware and law-abiding, you shouldn't get all whiny about obvious generalisations, because of course they don't include you. That strikes me as pointless as taking a class on feminism, and each time a statement is made about how men have treated and generally continue to treat women, someone would raise a hand and cry, "Well, I don't do that!" No, you don't--but the point of fact is, a huge number of others do.

Just how is the above statement in any way different from yours? Mine isn't PC because generalising minorities isn't, but calling the people who don't fit into any 'protected minority' sceme is?
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Ooohs, Aaaahs, and WHOA NELLY!!!

Postby Sassy-fras on Tue Sep 12, 2006 9:40 am

Okay...this is the part where I say....

Crash is the best movie ever!

O_O 'Cause I liked it, and the plot seems to pretty much encompass a lot of what everyone here is debating. Racial tension!!!

And then I share my thoughts....

...on how it'd be so interesting to see Aggie in that movie, talking to the two doods who battle against which is more oppressing towards black people.... hip hop/rap music, or country western. That was a great debate, 'cause it was funny...BUT that's not the topic. The topic is about hating on Aggie...which I won't. :o 'Cause I really don't hate any of the characters. So...I'm going to take myself out of this topic now since my post really doesn't make any sense.

:shifty: But I get the feeling the randomness of my post may seem slightly humorous to some. So whoo hoo for that! Because laughing about random, senseless things is FUN! :D
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Postby Freemage on Tue Sep 12, 2006 2:45 pm

1: There is a difference between black/white relations in the U.S., and almost any other comparison you could make, either here or in other countries. It's the product of the 'unique institution' (as it was called) of American slavery, followed by Jim Crow laws, segregation, and all the rest. Even in the U.S., there are only two minority groups who were put here involuntarily--the native american tribals who got overrun, and the Africans who were brought in as slaves. There's a process that occurs during 'normal' immigration that never really applied to black Americans.

2: Like it or not, the n-word (I will NOT type it out, even in a discussion about the word itself) has a role in that history which causes its current dichotomous use. When used by a white American, it draws upon the entire history I've referenced above, summing it up in a single, ugly word. When blacks use it, they do so deliberately to remove the power the word has to dehumanize. Whites cannot, because of that history, use the word in the same way. Period. As for "Cracker" or "Honky"... if America ever undergoes a major revolution, after which all the whites are enslaved for 400 years, followed by another 100 years of second-class citizenship, followed by 50-and-counting years to finally erase the last vestiges of that discrimination... then we can bitch about "cracker".

3: I should have known better, but I really wasn't trying to spawn a major racism discussion. Rather, I was trying to make the point that identifying someone by a particular trait in a derogatory fashion (in this case 'chubby') rather than either their role or their name, is insulting to an entire group who share that trait. I realize that wasn't the poster's intent, but it does have a dehumanizing effect, whether they wanted it to or not. Language is wierd and strange, and words often have more power than we realize.

Oh, and "Crash" annoyed me, because it's become a canard in Hollywood that you apparently cannot discuss race relations without a scene in which a woman is molested or raped. My fiancee's college has a mandatory course in cultural diversity; the professor initially assigned Crash as a 'homework' assignment (watch it, talk about the movie's dealing with the issue of rape). But the scene in which the racist cop molests the black woman was so disturbing she couldn't make it through the rest of the movie. So the professor offered her two other movies instead; BOTH of them contained gratuitous and fairly graphic rape scenes.
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Re: Just to finish this off

Postby JackFairy on Tue Sep 12, 2006 11:31 pm

Thanks to Freemage for pointing out why "Whites want... A" (especially when, as I said before, the vast, vast majority of white people do in fact want A) is different than saying "Nigger culture is B" especially when in fact B is not true for the majority of black people. And this is also why it's different telling white people (who still occupy the position of dominance and power in our society) not to get worked up over generalizations, and telling minorities who've been oppressed and subjugated for centuries thanks to some very specific generalizations of them to do so. But I looooove how you see the word "whites" to be somehow equivalent in that statement to "nigger."

It's always going to be different in our current political climate because the power relations between blacks and whites are so unequal. This is why, for instance, you can't have "racism" against white people in America; you can only have prejudice--because for racism, you'd need prejudice and power.

oddtail wrote:As a student of Linguistics (more precisely of English, actually), I must protest.


I agree with you. :-) That's why I immediately added that I actually think such a definition is BS--I was operating on popular and literary conceptions. (Ie, if you want to define "proper" English as English-from-England as opposed to American English, then you could say that "proper" English is standard British English--"standard" in this case meaning literary and formal English. But as you very rightly say, even that definition does not hold.)
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Postby Sassy-fras on Wed Sep 13, 2006 9:55 am

Freemage
Oh, and "Crash" annoyed me, because it's become a canard in Hollywood that you apparently cannot discuss race relations without a scene in which a woman is molested or raped. My fiancee's college has a mandatory course in cultural diversity; the professor initially assigned Crash as a 'homework' assignment (watch it, talk about the movie's dealing with the issue of rape). But the scene in which the racist cop molests the black woman was so disturbing she couldn't make it through the rest of the movie. So the professor offered her two other movies instead; BOTH of them contained gratuitous and fairly graphic rape scenes.


Even though I agree that Crash's plot line delt mostly with race relations, I didn't see that scene to "deal" with race. I saw it more in correlation to all the incidents reported by the media about women being molested by cops.
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Postby Freemage on Wed Sep 13, 2006 2:16 pm

Sassy: That was kind of my point, actually. In at least one of the other movies I mentioned, the date-rape scene has nothing to do with race. So why are these scenes in movies allegedly ~about~ race relations? It's gratuitous shock-value, not adding anything to the movies' narrative structures.
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Postby Ollie_Vera on Fri Sep 15, 2006 10:42 pm

Freemage wrote:As for "Cracker" or "Honky"... if America ever undergoes a major revolution, after which all the whites are enslaved for 400 years, followed by another 100 years of second-class citizenship, followed by 50-and-counting years to finally erase the last vestiges of that discrimination... then we can bitch about "cracker".

You know, I agree with almost anything you say ever, but that is BULL.

There doesn't need to be an enormous and ugly history behind a word to made the word enormously ugly. I consider someone calling me a "cracker" like me calling a black person a "nigger'"; it ain't good and shouldn't be tolerated.
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