QoW Update - Comic for 2/11

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QoW Update - Comic for 2/11

Postby Aeire on Tue Feb 10, 2004 9:53 pm

Is now up
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Postby squiddy on Tue Feb 10, 2004 10:00 pm

Everyone knows the butler has always been the mastermind behind Batman..and this proves it!

Or something.
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Postby LemonyFreshEvil on Tue Feb 10, 2004 10:42 pm

ahem...

<singing>memememeeeeeeeeeee....</singing>




HERESY!!!!


Now that's out of the way...

That would be the outcome of another dollar grabbing Batman film.

I like Batman... Superman should be deported, however.
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Postby bloodeye on Wed Feb 11, 2004 12:39 am

I'm senceing something of a batman obcession here.... not that I mind. Still remember watching the cheesy TV show.
Was just annoyed when I kept forgetting, and miss how the heck they got out of the latest death trap.
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Postby Paraboombo on Wed Feb 11, 2004 5:04 am

Beee-Yotch!

Yay!
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Postby GrassyNoel on Wed Feb 11, 2004 8:26 am

Looks like a prequel - young Alfred and young Bruce.

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Postby DamnedEyez on Wed Feb 11, 2004 12:06 pm

Batman Beyond....I thought Bruce was the old guy and Batman was some young kid...dunno if related or not.
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sorry bout the off topic bit.....

Postby LemonyFreshEvil on Wed Feb 11, 2004 12:29 pm

In the cartoon Batman Beyond Bruce Wayne was the old man, Terry Macginnes was the new batman.

That series was ok.

The current series 'Justice League' <god could someone just ax Superman & Wonder Woman PLEASE!!!!!> is starting to branch out into occult/Lovecraft territory when a couple of extra superpeople combined powers to defeat Ixthultu <read: Cthulhu> from barging into this dimension. Ixthultu's followers were creatures that were from the sea and had many tenticles like their master. It was an interesting two episodes.

Something about similar yet legally distinct.... :roll:
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Postby AmanuJaku on Wed Feb 11, 2004 1:48 pm

Oh, don't tell me that the Hyper-Magical Pretty-Pretty Transformation Sequence for Batman and Robin (the live-action TV show) wasn't fall-off-your-chair funny. Aerie continues to put out so many strips that I love, it's no wonder that this is one of my favorite web comics to read, and believe me, I read a lot of web comics a day (today, for example, I read 108 comics as part of my regular site maintenence).

In reference to Batman Beyond, Terry Macginnes's father was murdered while Terry was just a teen, and Bruce felt a sort of kinship with him over their mutal tragedies. I really liked how the finally explained what happened to the original Robin in the Batman Beyond movie the Return of the Joker. I was sort of annoyed when I didn't see him in the series at first, but I found it cool when they explained what happened to Superman and other various superheroes.

Ah. The Justice Legue. I noticed the massive change to Wonder Woman (I guess it mirrors the comics), and it does chafe slightly with me. Really, the only reason why I watch the series is for the Joker (batman is cool too, when you think about it. His only super power is that he can go for really long times without sleep.), because Mark Hammel rocks as a voice actor. If the Joker didn't show up every couple of episodes, I don't think I would really watch it all that much. mMaybe because Flash and Darksde are starting to grow on me, but that's about it. As for the occult angle, I noticed there was a time in DC that they started into that, like with the demon storyline in the Batman comics. So it's only natural that they address it. You tend to know you're not really into the series when you are rooting for the super villians to wipe out everyone but Batman.

Ah well.
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Postby Adam The Alien on Wed Feb 11, 2004 6:04 pm

Alfred rocks. Always has. And that's all I have to say about that.

In regard to other subjects, though...

Batman TV show: Funny, but overall ruined the image of Batman and comic books as a whole. Sure, the comics used to be cheesy...but people can forget about that. Nobody ever forgets about the show, because it was a cool show. Nevertheless, a stain on Batman's image. The kind that, unlike the cheesy comics of old, doesn't wash out.

Batman movies: They just need to start over. The first two, I thought, were cool, but they could have done better. After that...oy. They need to start over, and pretend all the others never happened. Hey, not like they haven't done it before when it comes to comic book films and TV series...

Batman Beyond: Breathed new life into Batman at a time when it looked like Batman could no longer survive outside of the comic world. I loved the show...anyone know why they stopped making it?

Justice League: I don't get the Cartoon Network. But I knew it was a baaaaaaad idea. The Justice League "best-of-the-best" combo of heroes, in my opinion, only works well when the members each have their own seperate series running for their own adventures. As far as TV is concenred, it would be better for at least some of them to have their own series, and have an occasional "Justice League" special, a la the "Worlds Finest" thing with the Batman/Superman cartoons.

Of course, the problem with just about any superhero cartoon is making the mistake of targeting them at younger and younger audiences. Honestly, they forget about their older audience, who desire decent plots and animation, and work so hard to appeal to an audience that'll be happy to watch anything that's a cartoon. And considering, from a marketing angle, the fact that teenagers are the biggest spenders, you'd think they'd at least aim the damn things at teens...
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Postby crypto on Wed Feb 11, 2004 6:31 pm

And lets not forget how badly the Teen Titans got f***ed in the cartoon version.

They made it so. . . so. . I have no word for that show.
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Postby WannaBee on Wed Feb 11, 2004 8:16 pm

The Justice League Show IS aimed at older teens.
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Postby bloodeye on Wed Feb 11, 2004 9:44 pm

Do not mention Teen Titans again. Ever. They had a decent chance there for a good show, and failed, very, very badly.
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Postby Starman Matt on Wed Feb 11, 2004 9:52 pm

I'm not a big fan of the Teen Titans show, but I realize that I am not the target audience. It is aimed at the same kids who think Yugi-Oh is the greatest thing ever.

That said, some good is coming of it. I've had a lot of kids in my store looking for old Titans books, so I've been showing off a lot of the old Perez and Wolfman books that are safe for kids. I have a few regulars who keep coming back for more and kids who are reading more... "sensible" material as a result of a TV show I can't stand.

*shrugs* I don't have to watch it. Just reap the benefits. Works for me.

Justice League still kicks though. I loved the episode where SUperman get blasted into the future, meets Vandal Savage, says that he is insane and VS agrees but notes "Just because I'm crazy doesn't mean I'm not good company."
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Postby Jeffro on Thu Feb 12, 2004 9:40 am

Kestrel proves that insanity is the BEST company.

And again Aerie this is another great Batman kick in the nuts, even though I'm a day late commenting...it's not my fault!
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Postby crypto on Thu Feb 12, 2004 10:11 am

They tooks such well created charecters and sapped the brains out of them.

Star is nothing but an air head, Robin's an over confident Jag off, Beast boy and Cy are comic reliefe, and Raven. . .

There is aiming for a younger audience, then there is offencively simlified.

If I ever track down the creatures of theat show. . .
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Ooh, best idea I've heard today! Or read, i guess...


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Postby Godfather on Thu Feb 12, 2004 2:47 pm

To hell with The Justice League, we need to go back to the original Superfriends. Now THERE'S a cartoon!!!
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Postby Adam The Alien on Fri Feb 13, 2004 2:06 am

See now, my last paragraph was referring to Teen Titans as part of a whole. As for Justice League being aimed at older teens? Bah. Let's see it on a channel I actually get, then I'll believe. Maybe. :D

And as far as target audiences go, I just think marketing gets too involved in it all. Really, they can easily have a wide audience, from little kids to adults. But nooooooo, that's too risky. Risk? Baaaaaaaaad. Using an overused, precise formula aimed at a relatively narrow target audience? Gooooooood. Ah, the mindset of marketing. Of course, even the worst cartoon I've seen is better than those frightening commercials Fox subjects my little sis to every Saturday morning...honestly, when something's so aimed at the ADD/ADHD mindset that someone who actually has the damn disorder has to leave the room, something needs to be done. Something drastic.

Forget overthrowing the government, we need to sick the anarchists on the marketers. :P
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Postby DamnedEyez on Fri Feb 13, 2004 5:43 am

Marketers and the Networks in general. (Although, getting rid of the marketers may stop the Networks from behaving so ridiculous just to try to get the best ratings so they can charge insane amounts for advertising time.)
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BATMAN!...nanananananananana...BATMAN!

Postby AmanuJaku on Mon Feb 16, 2004 1:15 pm

Most networks have the misconception that comics and cartoons are watched by kids, however, Cartoon network is pretty good with their programs. It's not like they actually create Teen Titans or Justice League, but rather just show them.

Adam, I agree with your ideas for the movies, Batman beyond, and the Justice league. I just don't understand why the movie executives decided that batman had to fight at least two villians each time. There is never enough time to go through the backstories of each character and their interactions with batman.

Don't get me started on their habits of killing all of the supervillians. I was extremely upset when the Joker died, as he was my favorite Batman villian. Then marvel went along with it by killing the Green goblin. I just hope that Doctor Octopus doesn't get killed.

Also, what's with all of the neon lights in all of the later movies? Bad guys with red-neon guns and batman with blue-neon gadgets? I din't think that Batman was set in the "future".

I wouldn't mind it if the Cartoon Network made their own DC or Marvel superhero series for Adult Swim, as I feel they could potentially make it a little bit more for teens or adults.
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Re: BATMAN!...nanananananananana...BATMAN!

Postby Adam The Alien on Mon Feb 16, 2004 2:31 pm

AmanuJaku wrote:Don't get me started on their habits of killing all of the supervillians. I was extremely upset when the Joker died, as he was my favorite Batman villian. Then marvel went along with it by killing the Green goblin. I just hope that Doctor Octopus doesn't get killed.


I thought it was okay with the Joker. But it could have gone either way and still been fine by me. I love the joker, and I thought it was a pretty good way for him to go.

As for the Green Goblin...well, he did die in the comics, after all. HOWEVER they should have waited unitl at least the second movie. At least. Heck, I wouldn't have even made him the major villain in the first one. Build the character's quasi-trust up first, then make him a villain. That, if I recall, is what they did in the comics and even managed it in the 90's Fox cartoon. Heck, they really should have saved his death for several movies down the line, giving them time to introduce Gwen Stacy so they could have the Goblin kill her. But oh noooooooooo, they had to cram years worth of Spidey/Goblin history into the movie, making the story fail as a whole, and instead of dropping Gwen off the bridge and having her actually die, it was Mary Jane and a bunch of kids...all of whom lived.
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Re: BATMAN!...nanananananananana...BATMAN!

Postby Starman Matt on Mon Feb 16, 2004 5:50 pm

AmanuJaku wrote:Most networks have the misconception that comics and cartoons are watched by kids, however, Cartoon network is pretty good with their programs. It's not like they actually create Teen Titans or Justice League, but rather just show them.


Justice League is actually written on a more adult level, kinda like the Muppets. There's stuff that both the kids and the adults can enjoy. I forget the exact circumstances, but there was one episode where Flash eluded to Playboy Magazine (not mentioned by name) and then quickly added "I just read it for the articles!"

AmanuJaku wrote:Adam, I agree with your ideas for the movies, Batman beyond, and the Justice league. I just don't understand why the movie executives decided that batman had to fight at least two villians each time. There is never enough time to go through the backstories of each character and their interactions with batman.


Oh yeah. And lets not forget how this resulted in the insane pairing of Poison Ivy (wants to take Humanity back to nature) vs. Mr. Freeze (wants to freeze entire planet solid). Kinda working at cross-purposes, on account of.. you know... ICE KILLS MOST PLANT LIFE!

AmanuJaku wrote:Don't get me started on their habits of killing all of the supervillians. I was extremely upset when the Joker died, as he was my favorite Batman villian. Then marvel went along with it by killing the Green goblin. I just hope that Doctor Octopus doesn't get killed.


The trend of killing the bad guys had nothing to do with it. In the original comics, The Green Goblin did die in the exact same circumstances as shown in the movie. The biggest difference was that in the original comics, the girlfriend thrown off the bridge was Gwen Stacy and that she did die before Spider-Man chased down the Goblin, confronted him, and then jumped out of the way of a sneak attack.
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Postby AmanuJaku on Tue Feb 17, 2004 12:50 pm

Very good points, both of you. :D I enjoy a good discussion.

I was more upset with the idea that the Joker would not be returning in the movies again. I was secretly hoping for a teamup of some of batman's villians in a later movie (where you could just recap some events from past movies) and focus on the plot on hand. Kind of like one big live-action comic (as the movies were intended to be). Or even crossovers with other superheros (say Justice League for example).

I know that the original Green Goblin did indeed die, but I was hoping for something like X-men, where the writers at least had the idea of "Gee, maybe we shouldn't kill off one of our big villians". So that the quasi-father/son relationship could take place. I would have preferred an appearance of the green goblin, but the focus have been on The Vulture, and had the ending on some cliffhanger. By doing that, it probably would have made some people claw at the seats, since there was no real resolution of the overall plot. Then they could make it an ongoing movie series, with no real visible end, and maintain some of Spiderman's core villians (those who live).

Mmm. I will say that Justice League is written on a higher level than some cartoons, as they are at least taking into account the people who grew up reading the comics (not that I am that old, I'm only 26).

Ivy and Mr. Freeze is the best example, but don't forget that Bane was in the movie too. That last movie was just a hodge-podge of Batman villians, with a weak story, and zany weaponry, that I didn't even bother to see it in the theaters.

I would have preferred Patric Stewart to play Mr. Freeze (as he was originally offered the role but since they felt that the audience wouldn't understand why he'd be so strong without looking it, he didn't get the part), but we don't always get what we want. I do feel he played a great job as Professor X, though.
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Postby Adam The Alien on Tue Feb 17, 2004 9:05 pm

AmanuJaku wrote:I was secretly hoping for a teamup of some of batman's villians in a later movie (where you could just recap some events from past movies) and focus on the plot on hand. Kind of like one big live-action comic (as the movies were intended to be). Or even crossovers with other superheros (say Justice League for example).

Easier said than done. Easy enough to do in an ongoing TV series, but it's a lot harder to do in feature-length movie format. Maybe as a movie-esque mini-series, but it'd take a long line of good sequels to pull off a major villain team-up, and that sort of thing doesn't happen too often, especially in the comic movie genre.

AmanuJaku wrote:I know that the original Green Goblin did indeed die, but I was hoping for something like X-men, where the writers at least had the idea of "Gee, maybe we shouldn't kill off one of our big villians". So that the quasi-father/son relationship could take place. I would have preferred an appearance of the green goblin, but the focus have been on The Vulture, and had the ending on some cliffhanger. By doing that, it probably would have made some people claw at the seats, since there was no real resolution of the overall plot. Then they could make it an ongoing movie series, with no real visible end, and maintain some of Spiderman's core villians (those who live).

The cliffhanger ending works only if the filmmakers, without a shadow of a doubt, that there will be a sequel (horror films are an exception to this, despite the fact that most of them end up making sequels anyway). And the only real way to guarantee this is to film the movie with the cliffhanger and the next part at the same time. Allowing a break in the major filming, even if it were a project like Lord of the Rings, puts too many variables into the equation, too many things that can go utterly wrong. And then, when they fail to produce a sequel, everyone's pissed, from audience to financers to the filmmakers themselves.

AmanuJaku wrote:Ivy and Mr. Freeze is the best example, but don't forget that Bane was in the movie too. That last movie was just a hodge-podge of Batman villians, with a weak story, and zany weaponry, that I didn't even bother to see it in the theaters.

They ruined Ivy, Mr. Freeze, and I think they ruined Bane most of all. From big, strong, villain who broke Batman's back and ran a criminal empire for a bit to mindless lacky runt. Yes, runt. And come on...they had Arnold...and they made him Mr. Freeze. They had Bane in the script, and they made Arnold into Mr. Freeze.

AmanuJaku wrote:I would have preferred Patric Stewart to play Mr. Freeze (as he was originally offered the role but since they felt that the audience wouldn't understand why he'd be so strong without looking it, he didn't get the part), but we don't always get what we want. I do feel he played a great job as Professor X, though.

Patrick Stewart would have made a decent Mr. Freeze. Personally, I would've gone with someone way geekier. :D Maybe that guy who played Egon in Ghostbusters, eh?

Oh, and they felt the audience wouldn't understand why he'd be so strong without looking it (despite the fact that we see that in movies all the time)...and they felt the audience could accept Arnold as a scientist?? :P
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Postby AmanuJaku on Mon Feb 23, 2004 2:26 pm

Oh, I know that Hollywood will rarely make movies like they did Lord of the Rings and the Harry Potter series, but I can still dream. Maybe if the comic genre starts proving to be a lucrative market, then they might try some experiments like that.

It really doesn
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