[S.T.O.R.Y. 1/26/02] Ad Libs!

[Chaos Priest]

http://www.egscomics.com/d/20020126.html

Oh, I love these things. Well, OK, not really, but for the sake of crappy humor, today I do! Now let's see... for this one it's <verb> <noun> <noun> Can anybody think of some good ones?

On a side note, this just gave me an idea for a Strip Slay. Be back in a bit
*scurries off*

[Illusionist]

Anything I suggest will cause Baby Jesus to come into existence, purely so my post will make him cry.

[Tuitsuro]

Propel, Toad, Boomerang.

As randomly assigned by this site.

It sounds like something the Mythbusters would do, actually. O_o

[The Old Hack]

Defenestrate, phone bill, rocket launcher.

[CooperNRG]

Drop, Bug, Suit...

Makes no sense what so ever!

[Tuitsuro]

Defenestrate, phone bill, rocket launcher.

Take that Sprint!

[kyevan]

lick, kitten, tongue

It's a very dirty kitten and needs lots of cleaning.

[Puffs]

steal, heart, words

[The Old Hack]

Defenestrate, phone bill, rocket launcher.

Take that Sprint!

This has nothing at all to do with the fact that I have now twice been subjected to a phone company not only billing me for a service I hadn't ordered or had discontinued, but in both cases let it pass on to a snapping COLLECTION AGENCY in order to make me pay. Happily for me, the agency in question did not seem inclined to pursue either case once I explained matters to them -- and showed them I had the paperwork to back me up.

Oh, and the company recently folded and was taken over by competitors. I have no idea why.

[ChronosCat]

===Spring, 2006===

*Chronos of 2006 reports on his thoughts regarding the strip to the time-traveling Crystal of 2008*

I like the title - I've thought the same thing (minus the "dirty") regarding fantasy stories and those who think them evil. I also like the stereotypical German scientist, though I wonder why they're always German - just because of Einstein?

His methodology could use a little work - using what Anime and Manga say as evidence of what goes on in the real world is even worse than fundamentalists that use what their holy book says as proof of things. At least the Bible, Koran, and such are meant as non-fiction, even if there isn't any proof that they are as infallible as the followers of the corresponding religions often claim.

The second panel brings up another issue - the abuse of males by females seen in some Anime. While it's funny if the victim truly deserved it, in series such as Love Hina and Ranma 1/2 it's often based on misunderstandings and done by girls with hair-trigger tempers. I don't think it's appropriate treating abuse like that as humor, and I hope this series doesn't fall into that trap.

[kyevan]

Mmm, it'll clean up before Chronos hits the end of the archives, if memory serves.

[Michael Brazier]

Clean, desk, toothbrush.

Now that I've read the strip ... that's incredibly risque ...

[Chaos Priest]

The second panel brings up another issue - the abuse of males by females seen in some Anime. While it's funny if the victim truly deserved it, in series such as Love Hina and Ranma 1/2 it's often based on misunderstandings and done by girls with hair-trigger tempers. I don't think it's appropriate treating abuse like that as humor, and I hope this series doesn't fall into that trap.

Frankly some of the time I'd say even the "innocent" victims like Ranma and Keitaro have it coming because they act like such idiots in those situations it's like they're going out of their way to get beaten. Like when Ranma tried to break into the girl's locker room to get the Japanese Nannichuan. I'm still not sure how many idiot balls he was juggling during that one. He deserved every blow and humiliation during that.

[Illusionist]

True, but often it's an innocent man. I'm sick and tired of seeing abusive situations in fiction go unremarked, when if the genders were reversed every woman in the country would be up in arms.

Take Scrubs, for example - in one episode, a female doctor/lawyer/I forget what walk down a hallway, beating up male doctors to appropriate background music. It's horrible, and yet we are expected to laugh. Would the same scene be played for laughs with a male doctor/whatever abusing female doctors? Would it even get filmed?

Some women may complain of misogyny in our society, but from where I'm sitting there looks to be an awful lot of misandry as well.

[CooperNRG]

True, but often it's an innocent man. I'm sick and tired of seeing abusive situations in fiction go unremarked, when if the genders were reversed every woman in the country would be up in arms.

Take Scrubs, for example - in one episode, a female doctor/lawyer/I forget what walk down a hallway, beating up male doctors to appropriate background music. It's horrible, and yet we are expected to laugh. Would the same scene be played for laughs with a male doctor/whatever abusing female doctors? Would it even get filmed?

Some women may complain of misogyny in our society, but from where I'm sitting there looks to be an awful lot of misandry as well.

What exactly is the historical ratio of female on male physical abuse to male on female physical abuse in the universe you're living in?

It's not the act itself, but the absurdity of the act, that's supposed to illicite a laugh

[Illusionist]

Frankly, I don't find that an acceptable explanation. Do you mean to suggest that females abusing males never happens?

OK, how about this - I'm going to write a script in which rich black people work white people to their gruesome deaths. The reverse happened in the past, so it'll be A OK, no matter how horrible it is!

[CooperNRG]

Frankly, I don't find that an acceptable explanation. Do you mean to suggest that females abusing males never happens?

OK, how about this - I'm going to write a script in which rich black people work white people to their gruesome deaths. The reverse happened in the past, so it'll be A OK, no matter how horrible it is!

In a COMEDY, it would be played for laughs, and the juxtaposition of what they are portraying to what actually happened IRL would lend to the absurdity of what's happening.

There's never been (in the US) female on male abuse (or black on white servile abuse) on level with male on female abuse (or white on black servile abuse)...not even close!

Going back to your original point:

Would the same scene be played for laughs with a male doctor/whatever abusing female doctors?

When you portray male on female abuse (or white on black servile abuse), none of the absurdity is there that's there with the opposite!

[Illusionist]

But your explanation hinges on the very idea of women abusing men being absurd. It's NOT absurd. If something's expected to be funny because it's absurd, it should actually be absurd. The really surprising thing was that my example came from Scrubs, which usually has good writing.

This is all secondary to my main point, which is that misandry or the objectification of men is often ignored where misogyny or the objectification of women would draw criticism. The whole "we were victims, now we shall victimise with impunity" mindset is one of the great problems with modern Western society.

I can accept something that shouldn't be funny being played for laughs, unless it's a symptom of that.

[CooperNRG]

But your explanation hinges on the very idea of women abusing men being absurd.

It is absurd in the sense that there is/was no time (at least in US history) that women beating men was socially acceptable. There were times (unfortunately) that the opposite was true.

This is all secondary to my main point, which is that misandry or the objectification of men is often ignored where misogyny or the objectification of women would draw criticism.

This is because there needs to be a balance. The proliferation (and social acceptance) of a one sided objectification will expose the affected side to something somewhat analogous to what the other side went through (the same is happening in the US with affirmative action. Many minorities are being given preferential treatment based soley on race/ethnicity/other determining factors. This has had the affect of giving whites a small taste of what minorities went through in the past).

[Illusionist]

If we can all agree that prejudice is bad, how can prejudice being bad be used as an excuse for prejudice against innocent people?

What you suggest leads to an endless seesaw of prejudice, tipping first one way then the other. Many people on all sides have simply said "It was a long time ago, none of us were directly involved. Why should we stir up trouble again?", and that's actually a good way of thinking about it. If I was racist towards Italians because the Romans conquered Britain (well, most of it), that would be a bad thing, right? How about if I was racist towards the French because of the Normans? I could come up with some really good stuff about Norwegians and Scandinavians as well.

"An eye for an eye and a tooth for a tooth leaves the world blind and toothless" - Mahatma Gandhi.

[CooperNRG]

If we can all agree that prejudice is bad, how can prejudice being bad be used as an excuse for prejudice against innocent people?

If we (speaking as a white male) experience something even remotely like what they (speaking of minorities) went through, we (again, speaking as a white male) can truly understand what they (again, speaking of minorities) went through, and we (refering to all people) can therefore be absolutely motivated to insure that it doesn't happened again.

What you suggest leads to an endless seesaw of prejudice, tipping first one way then the other. Many people on all sides have simply said "It was a long time ago, none of us were directly involved. Why should we stir up trouble again?

Guess what! In the US, it wasn't "a long time ago." There are people alive today who were DIRECTLY affected by such things. Some of my older relatives (going back to our original point) lived in a time when male on femal abuse was, if not socially accepted, not completely villified! And guess what! Some of them experienced that abuse FIRST HAND!

If I was racist towards Italians because the Romans conquered Britain (well, most of it), that would be a bad thing, right? How about if I was racist towards the French because of the Normans? I could come up with some really good stuff about Norwegians and Scandinavians as well.

Romans: More than 1500 years ago! Normans: Almost a 1000 years ago! Totally not the same!

"An eye for an eye and a tooth for a tooth leaves the world blind and toothless" - Mahatma Gandhi.

And if they hadn't broken away from Great Britain, they'd still probably be second class citizens of the Empire (or at least dealing with the racial backlash).

[Illusionist]

If we can all agree that prejudice is bad, how can prejudice being bad be used as an excuse for prejudice against innocent people?

If we (speaking as a white male) experience something even remotely like what they (speaking of minorities) went through, we (again, speaking as a white male) can truly understand what they (again, speaking of minorities) went through, and we (refering to all people) can therefore be absolutely motivated to insure that it doesn't happened again.

Do we need the Jews to go around murdering aryans so we don't repeat the Holocaust? Do we need Japan to bomb America so nobody will drop nuclear bombs again? If you think Humans are incapable of learning from past mistakes, you obviously have a very low opinion of humanity.

What you suggest leads to an endless seesaw of prejudice, tipping first one way then the other. Many people on all sides have simply said "It was a long time ago, none of us were directly involved. Why should we stir up trouble again?

Guess what! In the US, it wasn't "a long time ago." There are people alive today who were DIRECTLY affected by such things. Some of my older relatives (going back to our original point) lived in a time when male on femal abuse was, if not socially accepted, not completely villified! And guess what! Some of them experienced that abuse FIRST HAND!

What, you don't count the 19th century as a long time ago? As for the fist hand stuff: How old are these people? I'd wager they're no spring chickens.

If I was racist towards Italians because the Romans conquered Britain (well, most of it), that would be a bad thing, right? How about if I was racist towards the French because of the Normans? I could come up with some really good stuff about Norwegians and Scandinavians as well.

Romans: More than 1500 years ago! Normans: Almost a 1000 years ago! Totally not the same!

In principal, it's very similar. I was not directly involved with any of the events you are saying could be used as excuses for prejudice. I don't know anybody who was. Why, then, should anybody I know even talk about it outside of a History lesson?

"An eye for an eye and a tooth for a tooth leaves the world blind and toothless" - Mahatma Gandhi.

And if they hadn't broken away from Great Britain, they'd still probably be second class citizens of the Empire (or at least dealing with the racial backlash).

He had a point, though, you have to admit.

[CooperNRG]

Do we need the Jews to go around murdering aryans so we don't repeat the Holocaust? Do we need Japan to bomb America so nobody will drop nuclear bombs again? If you think Humans are incapable of learning from past mistakes, you obviously have a very low opinion of humanity.

Way to strawman my position. I was very clear when I say "something even remotely like what they went through" and not "exactly what they went through." Do I advocate selling whites into slavery to blacks or the actual, IRL, beating of men by women? No. To insinuate that my position is such is a blatant insult to me! Something akin to the afroementioned US affirmative action should be implamented in the Germany for jews and the other minorities that were persecuted (if it hasn't already been done).

What, you don't count the 19th century as a long time ago?

First off, no, the 19th century is not a long time ago! Second, I was refering to the early 20th century.

As for the fist hand stuff: How old are these people? I'd wager they're no spring chickens

This is probably one of the most asinine things I think I've ever heard/read on this topic! So what if they're not spring chickens! Does that somehow invalidate what they went through? Not to mention that many of their chldren have assimilated their ideals (male on female abuse is by no means dead, and even though I don't have any figures, I'm willing to bet that the ratio of female on male abuse is disproportionally high, and that DOES NOT mean I advocate the increase of female on male abuse to balance the ratio).

My anger at some of your above comments has forced me to put you on ignore! Just thought you'd like to know why I'll no longer be replying to your comments.

[Illusionist]

Strawman? I only applied your logic to different situations. If that's me strawmanning you, almost every single debate on the planet has eventually descended into strawmanning. Also, if every company on the planet hires people according to history and quotas, every single company on the planet will go bust due to shoddy work. If the best person for the job just happens to be a poor black woman, hire her. If, however, the best person for the job is a middle class WASP, hire him. Any company that thinks "Hey, we don't have a Chinese guy. Let's hire an incompetent one over a competent white guy just so we have one." is obviously run by morons.

Secondly, yes, the 19th century is a long time ago. 108 years is a long time.

Thirdly, you missed my point. I was saying that the issues you raise - rampant male on female abuse, for instance - are nothing like as prevalent as they were when your relatives experienced them.

Somebody please quote this so Cooper can see that it was a misunderstanding. Alternatively, please inform him that it's good manners to let your opponent explain himself, instead of leaping to conclusions.

[Ineluki]

Strawman? I only applied your logic to different situations. If that's me strawmanning you, almost every single debate on the planet has eventually descended into strawmanning. Also, if every company on the planet hires people according to history and quotas, every single company on the planet will go bust due to shoddy work. If the best person for the job just happens to be a poor black woman, hire her. If, however, the best person for the job is a middle class WASP, hire him. Any company that thinks "Hey, we don't have a Chinese guy. Let's hire an incompetent one over a competent white guy just so we have one." is obviously run by morons.

Secondly, yes, the 19th century is a long time ago. 108 years is a long time.

Thirdly, you missed my point. I was saying that the issues you raise - rampant male on female abuse, for instance - are nothing like as prevalent as they were when your relatives experienced them.

Somebody please quote this so Cooper can see that it was a misunderstanding. Alternatively, please inform him that it's good manners to let your opponent explain himself, instead of leaping to conclusions.

np, we don't need more hostility here...