knights of other orders...

The noble Order of the Knights of Jubal traces its origins back to the Year Two Thousand A.D., when a group of distinguished persons of good and true character, founded the order to promote chivalry and honour. The order takes its name from our leader, Alexander Jubal McRae, who on two (so far) occasions has been seriously injured, in one case fatally, defending an innocent woman from attackers.

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Postby Manhattan on Thu Jun 28, 2001 11:43 am

a friend on another board is a black belt martial artist (and i am ashamed to say that i cannot remember the system!) and he posted recently of the passing of one of the Masters, Master Longo, and when he did he listed the seven codes of his order : Honor, Justice, Courage, Loyalty, Benevolence, Veracity and Kindness. i just loved this idea. this is obviously not a chivalric order but it certainly seems to have similar values. i wonder what other "orders" of knights there are out there that i haven't heard of yet. any ideas?<P>~mattie
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Postby BandMan2K on Mon Jul 02, 2001 9:29 am

Other than from the well-known ones such as Order of the Crown of the British Empire which seems to allow anyone nice to Britian and i think that it's eroded itself by admitting a lot of stupid people in its ranks i would have no real clue. perhaps someone might have an idea...<P>------------------
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Postby Atlas_v1.1 on Thu Jul 19, 2001 1:20 am

I know that all three of the Great Crusader Orders are still alive. The Hospitallers and Teutones have existed in an unbroken line of Grand Masters since their inception, and the SMOTJ (Sovereign Military Order of the Temple of Jerusalem - the Templars) has recently (in 18-something) come to the fore again, showing a charter of Grand Masters back to Jacques de Molay, the last public Grand Master, who was burned at the stake in 1310, IIRC. Thus, the three orders are still alive and kicking, and still taking in members.
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Postby BandMan2K on Thu Jul 19, 2001 10:06 am

Good to know, however all three make you proclaim to Christ your loyalty if they're anything like their Previous members and practices. I'd just as soon NOT cross their paths or deal with them right now, perhaps however, we may be able to give them a run for their money... ?<P>------------------
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Postby Seldom on Fri Jul 20, 2001 1:05 am

Although I am not a Knight of your Order, nor even a Companion of your Order, this query rang in my mind such that I felt obligated to respond. Your Order would be referred to as a Casual Order, as opposed to a Fraternal or Noble Order. This definition stems from your open acceptance of any member holding your vitrues at heart, and your lack of trail for membership. A Fraternal Order would require a sponsor within its membership in order to obtain audience, and a Noble Order would require proof of Nobility in a relevant form, such as wealth, nom de lourdes, etc. <P>Webster lesson aside, your Order's creed is admirable... a rarity among Casual Orders. The Order I serve within is similar. To assuage your isolation, Chivalrous Orders of the Casual state exist in various states of veracity and development throughout the world... you are by no means alone. As for your Order in particular, I commend you for your cosmopolitian embrace of symbolic truth. Many would scoff at the founding of a philosophy, let alone an Order, on the shoulders of a character of fiction, but your literature proves your mettle and your understanding. In the end, Chivalry is action, not oratory, and it seems you understand that. <P>I hope you forgive my intrusion, I have intended no trespass. Devotion and Truth guide you in your way; Fear and Doubt never sway you.<P>-Seldom
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et al
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Postby Jim Brockman on Fri Jul 20, 2001 10:14 am

Seldom,<P>Thank you. It is good to hear from a membewr of another order.<P>Perhaps you could tell us a bit about it?
<B> please...</B><P>(As I posted in another thread, my curiosity will eventually get me killed.)<P>------------------
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Postby Rei on Sat Jul 21, 2001 12:16 am

*chuckle*<P>hey Jim, if you're going down, I'll be keeping you company!<P>Please, Seldom, I'd like to hear of other orders too <P>ciao
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Postby Seldom on Sat Jul 21, 2001 2:53 am

In the name of peace, such do I share.<P>We are the Three Orders. Each given a journey, a portion of our duty, a third of our intent, we are whole only together.<P>That is the first pledge of the Knights of the Three Orders. Each of the Orders themsleves is autonomous and self-motivating, but our codes and ways cause an intermingling of position and direction that end with all of us holding many statures. I will tell you what I can as Veritas gives me leave to share. For now, I can tell you of my ranks, and of our intentions.<P>The Three Orders were founded in December of 1950, gathered out of an assortment of the wealthy and the devoted, who saw need for a group to attempt the betterment of life. They became Benefactors, nominating and sponsoring Knights into the Three Orders, and equipping them for their tasks from the fortunes they possessed. Each of the Orders seeks a different sort, and the Knights True are fewer than any, because they receive the title only when they acheive good and appropriate standing in all Three Orders. Each Order is a portion of the intent of the whole, and therefore, they are bound to function as a group. The cooperation and devotion necesary to continue our work keeps us humble, as the self-righteous and prideful are the downfall of the true.<P>The Silent Shields are the "angels of the urban night" as Veritas would so dramatically describe them. We are not so flashy. Neighbourhood watches, outreach programs, teaching self-defense, mentoring, all of these are the Shields' purview. The Testament says that "... and in a good and safe world, all men seek to do better, for they lack the fear and desperation to act for the detriment of others." Thus, the Shields seek to make living safer, to allow others to live better.<P>The Order of the Merciful Truth was built on the adage, "A wise man knows nothing but seeks to know everything." Their Order is devoted to education, both classroom, and real world, into the issues and subjects that must be known of to better our world. They are the ones who go to anything length to be sure that all options are open to all people, should they be willing to take them. They are often heard to say, "No man progresses without opportunity, No man falters without ignorance."<P>And last, but certainly not least, are the Quiet Eyes. The Quiet Eyes are philosophers and scholars. While the Merciful Truth is to teach, and the Silent Shield is to defend, the Quiet Eyes are to seek, and to learn. They are the Order that first sponsored me, and the Order to which I am most drawn. <P>All Three Orders adhere to similar codes, of action over inaction, devotion, and compassion, and all three are responsible for their own members, and for their members conduct and contributions to their Order, and to the Three Orders.<P>
I apologize for my vaguery, I seek carefully not to offend Veritas, my "Lord" you might say. He is careful of the information he releases, as we maintain as little presence as possible, lest we be defeated by our own reputation or expectation.<P>-Seldom
Knight True of the Three Orders.
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Postby Rei on Sun Jul 22, 2001 12:52 am

thankyou for sharing, Seldom. We understand that there are limits as to what you can share in such an open forum, but even what you can talk about is intriguing.<P>ta
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Postby Seldom on Sun Jul 22, 2001 1:02 am

Veritas has said that I may bring him your questions, and he will tell what I can answer of them.. so Ask away, and I will respond post haste.<P>-Seldom
True Knight of the Three Orders<P>"Curiousity only kills some cats... The craftiest hire the less crafty to find out for them... Smart, don't you think?"<P>-Fallingstar Hawk-Dreams, Crow Shaman.
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Postby DBLMagus on Sun Jul 22, 2001 8:17 am

wow, and here i thought that most of the knighthoods have traversed the path of those that have come before and disapeered. Its nice to know that in a world of greed and hatred there still remain knights in a sense who are willing to do what is right and good. i wish that more could be disclosed as my curiosity brims forth with just the smattering of details but i understand the need for secrecy. i should probably learn some common sense to go along with the curiosity or i might be joining jim and rei in dieing of it ^_^<P>hmm, wonder if theres a special place for people who die becuase of curiosity.
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Postby Jim Brockman on Tue Jul 24, 2001 7:55 am

Seldom,<P>Ok, here goes (I'll probably think of more latter)<P>How do these orders go about finding recruits?
You mentioned that the founders, sponsored individuals. Is the order still following that, or can the knights themselves sponsor an elligible individual?<P>What sort of ranking system is used?<P>What size are the activities of these ordrs? Communities, States/Provences, Countries...?<P>Who determines the direction the Orders should take? The Benefactors, the Knights or some combination of both?<P>Well I guess that's enough for now.<P>Thanks,
Jim B<P>------------------
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Postby Jim Brockman on Wed Jul 25, 2001 1:08 am

<BLOCKQUOTE><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by Seldom:
<B>Ranking is perhaps the most complex portion fo the Three Orders. There are four forms of rank, one for each individual Order, and one the applies to all three. As the full listing is extensive, I will provide it in email upon request, but not here. </B><HR></BLOCKQUOTE><P>I so Request:
jim_k_b@yahoo.com<P>------------------
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Postby Seldom on Wed Jul 25, 2001 1:41 am

Good questions, the lot, so one at a time.<P>Recruiting is done quietly, and carefully. We maintain ourselves as a private organisation in order to avoid a variety of legal and political complications to our work, such as limitations on charitable contribution and questioning of our "real agenda". We are too busy doing our work to spend time convincing the world that we mean well. If our actions do not speak well enough, then we will work harder. Talk is too cheap. Recruits, therefore, are found while working, met during volunteering, discovered in pursuit of similar goals, and so on. Only about 3 in 10 possibles are ever contacted. Of them, a good 2 reliable decline.<P>The Orders still very much support sponsorship. Although not all Pages are sponsored in, some being invited due to deeds done, as I was, we are very much the exception to the rule. <P>And Yes, Knights may sponsor Pages of their own. They must have a rank in good standing of at least the third step within their Order (More Later) to do so. More often, a Knight discovers an elligible individual, and directs a Lord or Benefactor's attention to them.<P>Ranking is perhaps the most complex portion fo the Three Orders. There are four forms of rank, one for eeach individual Order, and one the applies to all three. As the full listing is extensive, I will provide it in email upon request, but not here. Lords of each Order have complete control of structure and promotion within a given guideline, and ranking differs in title and function within each of the Orders. The Council of Lords rules on the universal rankings, and is the only body capable of the removal of rank. The only true consistency in ranking is the status of Page and Squire. All recruits begin as Pages, until they gravitate toward a given Order. They are then Squired to an established Knight in that Order, to learn that Order's rules and practices. Each Order must be Squired to separately, so it is not uncommon for a Knight's address to read, "Knight Master..., Squired to...".<P>As the Three Orders operate on a multinational level, now, our activities tend to vary wildly in size and scope. Our membership assists in their own names in everything from local food drives and housing intiatives to national disease awareness events and international goodwill missions. We try to be part of as much as possible in order to help larger, more overt groups coordinate, by knowing what everyone is doing.<P>Direction is a bit strange, but easily explained. Each Order has a small number of Lords, restaffed as they pass away or retire, though the numbers vary from Order to Order. The Lords have near absolute control of their Orders, with two exceptions. If a Lord requires, or wishes, the use of Knights of another Order (including Knights holding ranks in both Orders), they must put their intentions before the Council of Lords. The Council of Lords includes the Lords of all three Orders, and the Council Elect, a Lord promoted by popular vote to lead and maintain order within the Council. This is rarely to request the use of Knights, it is more often an informative gesture. The Orders intermingle to such an extent that it is rarely a problem to share. The other exception is when Monies or Properties are required. Then the Lords must go directly to the Benefactors. The Benefactors, while they have little or no direct control over the Orders themselves, control money and it distribution, and therefore wield reasonable clout. Their methods are their own, they began the Orders, or were chosen by those who did. We do not argue with them.
As such, the Lords have control, but the Benefactors have a sort of veto power, as they could deny funds to an event or project they disprove of.<P>
I hope that has proven enlightening.<P>-Seldom
Knight True of the Three Orders.<P>"Justice is blind, Compassion is weak, and Chivalry is dead. For being so crippled, we certainly get a lot done..."
-Veritas, Lord of Merciful Truth.
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Postby Kanaeda Kuonji on Fri Jul 27, 2001 10:27 am

As do I.<P>VanRichten37@hotmail.com<P><P>------------------
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Postby Silver Adept on Sat Jul 28, 2001 7:26 am

Impressive, Seldom. My hat's off to you. <P>However, one question still nags at my head, and I hope it can be answered. <P>You tell of a great many people, yet you seem to be as invisble as we are at the moment. Up until now, I have not heard anything of any of your Orders. <P>So my question is: If I should wonder where the Knights of the Three Orders are, how will I find them?
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Postby Seldom on Sat Jul 28, 2001 10:34 am

An interesting question...<P>If we are doing our jobs well, you won't.<P>If we are discovered to be some world-spanning "conspiracy" or "cult" then the sensational nature of modern culture will destroy our work. We have learned that discretion is the better part of stealth. We work, diligently, individually, and occasionally in very large groups, seking to better the world. That we are sometimes successful is our solace.<P>And if the world never knows we existed, then we will be happier still. <P>A great part of our intent is to show the world that common people can make a difference. A huge difference. We intend to be the proof, held up against history in a better time, and have none of our trappings and politics obscure the beauty of a more perfect, pleasant and livable world.<P>My presence here was allowed only after a long period of deliberation, and the personal efforts of my Lord Veritas himself, who is perhaps the most influential person in the Order right now. <P>I hope my efforts here encourage you to continue, and build your Order into something great. It took us forty years to really get moving... and once we did we became unstoppable.<P>-Seldom
Knight True of the Three Orders.<P>"If your devotion is sound, your actions cannot be in error, for sound devotion saves itself from breaking, guiding you from paths that would do you, and it, harm."<P>-Darius, Answers
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Postby Rei on Sat Jul 28, 2001 11:42 am

at the risk of being repetitive<P>ditto, please<P>subsetproductions@yahoo.com<P>ta
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Postby Silver Adept on Sun Jul 29, 2001 11:26 am

Somehow, I knew that was the answer that I would receive. <P>Ah, well. I knew that it would not be easy to better the world. This is why I'm starting young. If it takes forty years, so be it. Hell, if it takes four hundred before it rolls, fine with me. So long as it exists, and the world becomes a better place in part because it exists and because of the members in it, I'm satisfied.
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Postby Seldom on Mon Jul 30, 2001 1:49 am

One of my friends in the Shields said he would offer you a membership based on that statement, Silver, if he had the authority. That is what we are here for. With 50 years under our belt already, we are here for the long haul, and we do not see our work as a goal. We see our work as forever. No matter how much we improve the world, even perfection would require maintenance, lest it collapse back into imperfection. We do not see our work as ending before our race does, we merely see it as one day of work at a time, a day spent in the name of tomorrow.<P>-Seldom
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Knight Devout of the Order of Merciful Truth
Ghost of the Order of Quiet Eyes
et al
Knight Ambassador of the Three Orders.<P>"You need not fear our intervention any longer, Knight, for when you rise, you will rise a Ghost of our Order, and walk your own path in our name..."<P>-Veritas, Lord of the Order of Quiet Eyes.<P>
PS... I was promoted because of this post, and for contacting this group.. I felt you all should know.<p>[This message has been edited by Seldom (edited 07-30-2001).]
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Postby Rei on Mon Jul 30, 2001 2:27 am

*gives Seldom a hug*<P>congratulations on your promotion. May you and your fellow knights have many more years in service to the betterment of humanity<P>i hope our paths cross with more like-minded souls -- i for one have certainly learnt a lot in the short time of our acquaintence<P>rei
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Postby Jim Brockman on Tue Jul 31, 2001 1:50 am

<BLOCKQUOTE><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by Silver Adept:
<B><P>Either that, or I'm not thinking in the societal norm. Which is probably more likely.
</B><HR></BLOCKQUOTE><P>Ditto<P>BTW Please don't answer this Seldom. But the way you right makwes me think that perhaps you have been around here for a while.<P>Makes me wonder what other name I might know you by. <IMG SRC="http://www.keenspot.com/KeenBoard/biggrin.gif"><P><P>------------------
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Postby Silver Adept on Tue Jul 31, 2001 7:29 am

First, Seldom, congratulations upon your promotion. Rising in the ranks is always a prestigious thing. <P>Second, (and this is said with a tinge of humor.) if I could get into the Shields with something that, (well I believe) is obvious, then I'm surprised that the Three Orders have managed to stay under wraps, with so many possible candidates for membership. <P>Either that, or I'm not thinking in the societal norm. Which is probably more likely.<P>But also very disturbing. The perfection that you want, Seldom, as you note, needs to be maintained, because at any time, it can be toppled. However, is it easier to maintain when you have more people supporting it and repairing it an building on it? Of course. Perhaps, then, this is why Orders are founded. Because there is strength in numbers and people want to know that there are more people out there like them.
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Postby Seldom on Tue Jul 31, 2001 10:32 am

Post withheld by request. ::grins::<P>I'm new to Keenspot, but not to writing. I will entertain guesses, if you think you know me, but I doubt you do, this is the first time I;ve lifted my head.<P>-Seldom
Knight Ambassador of the Three Orders.<P>"I am a Pathological Liar."
-Modern Koans.<P>
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Postby RavenMistdancer on Wed Aug 01, 2001 11:13 am

Interesting,<P>All you have said, Seldom, is intruiging and enlightening, and for this I thank you. Just to know that such a noble Order is out there will ease my mind about the coming years our society, and the world as a whole, faces. Perhaps with Orders such as yours and, assuming I am inducted, mine (I just pledged today) out there, our children will grow up knowing kindness instead of anger. You give me much to think on, and much to discuss with my friends, and for this I thank you as well. Good day to you.<P>Raven <P>------------------
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