Anyone speak German?

It's not MAD science...just disappointed.

Moderator: Gav

Anyone speak German?

Postby Gav on Tue Apr 11, 2006 11:38 pm

Well, I think about half of you forum Nuclides are European, and while I don't remember anyone specifically being German, perhaps some of you are close enough to know German? This is a bit of mystery to me:

http://quadrate-deserteure.blogspot.com/

I tried having Google translate it, with amusing, but confusing results:

Google translation wrote:Straight one strikes the find of the so-called "Judas gospel" high waves (SpOn reports here .)
Why this thing is gehypt in such a way, is actually incomprehensible, because after the name and contents it is already in theology since that 1. Century admits: Irenaeus (135-202), bishop von Lyon, mentions it in its writings. It is not with considerable security a source, which opens us the "historical Jesus" better than the four again-testamentary EH gelists, but rather (formulated exaggerated) a kind advertising brochure gnostischen sparkling wines.
After the views of the Gnostiker (those for instance the matrix row strongly affected) the world is a prison, from which in the opinion of the Judas gospel Jesus was released by Judas ' betrayal. (case someone to it interest has, Dave Kopel's contribution with the VC is very worth reading).

Where was I? Oh, why the whole was still times those Giant sensation? Why is Dan Brown so successful? Why does each Schreiberling mean to be allowed to give halbgares to these topics by itself during the churches (those as too intellektualisiert to be often criticized) its quite serious historical-critical Bibelexegese is not bought?

Have Dan Brown & CO, which lengthen zelebrierten conspiracy theoretician, with whom names and qualifications are exchangeable, publicly in the media the ritual function taken off, which was carried out in former times by the churches? Oh, and interests that here at all possibly whom? I believe, contents anyway long the secondary matter became, the function of conspiracy theories am not to look for the truth but the demarcation of "those there above".
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Postby CodeGuy on Tue Apr 11, 2006 11:53 pm

Interesting, I ran it through altavista's bablefish and got the exact same results. They must use the same program.

Computer translations, what would we do without them. The only thing that competes is the old book "English as she is Spoke".
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Postby kamkiriad on Wed Apr 12, 2006 5:08 am

I tried it:

Currently the finding of the so called
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Postby Gav on Wed Apr 12, 2006 10:29 am

Interesting. I guess, as I suspected from the Google translation, that it has nothing to do with that Nukees strip at all.

Except maybe that he's discussing the "evolution of the church..." I guess it fits.

Thanks for your help!
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Postby CodeGuy on Wed Apr 12, 2006 10:56 am

The evolution of church idea is actually rather interesting. When I read Danny's comments a few days ago, my first thought was that it wouldn't work too well. It seems that often the success of a religion is based on the quality of the person pushing the religion (minister, preacher, prophet, etc) not the quality of what he is preaching. For example, sometimes a politician will pick a side on an issue based solely on what side his opponent is on. Under those circumstances, the best speaker could win and the religious tenants themselves have nothing to do with the "fitness" that allowed them to survive.

Then I thought about how the preacher can actually affect the religion. For example, a salesman who is seeing resistance might say "well what if you didn't have to follow Jewish law as part of this religion?" A good initial preacher might often be one who's willing to tweak the religion to make it suitable.

It's certainly interesting.
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Postby Gav on Wed Apr 12, 2006 12:14 pm

Actually, I don't really have enough time or space to go into any excruciating details in the comic strip itself, but I can certainly add more detail here.

It has been argued that the success of Christianity during Jesus' time wasn't so much one of ideology as accessibility. Basically, someone finally came along that brought religion to the lowest common denominator. You didn't have to be jewish anymore to follow the jewish "common man" faith, and you didn't have to have money anymore to get into heaven (as opposed to the "big" polytheistic religions of kings). It was basically the McDonald's of religions.

But the real issue is to look at the tenets of most modern religions themselves. Beliefs such as "be fruitful and multiply" are going to survive much better than that of say, the "Heaven's Gate" cult, which I don't believe has quite as many members today as Christianity.
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Postby Sidhekin on Wed Apr 12, 2006 12:20 pm

Gav wrote:It has been argued that the success of Christianity during Jesus' time wasn't so much one of ideology as accessibility. Basically, someone finally came along that brought religion to the lowest common denominator. You didn't have to be jewish anymore to follow the jewish "common man" faith, and you didn't have to have money anymore to get into heaven (as opposed to the "big" polytheistic religions of kings).

That would be in Peter's time -- and moreso, in Paul's. (Never mind that they were contemporaries.)

Other than that, spot on, I say.
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Postby bloodeye on Thu Apr 13, 2006 5:53 am

Persicution seems to help; unifies members, weeds out the half-hearted, and evokes sympathy from some other groups.
And while a strong central leader does help to start and maintian a group, it only lasts so long as the leader lives.
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Postby kiga on Fri Apr 14, 2006 10:02 pm

This has been a common topic in the sociology of religion for some time. Consider Max Weber's ideas relating Calvinism and capitalism, or the underpinnings of Chinese society in Confucianism and Taoism.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Max_Weber

Some recent research suggests (I forgot the source, sorry) that churches that make more demands on their members tend to flourish more than churches that demand less. This caused some stir among economists who would have predicted the opposite.

The situation for early Christianity depends on the precise time period we're talking about. Consider:

1. 33-45 CE: Christianity is a form of Judaism, and mainly only relevant to Jews. Reasons to join: radical message, enfranchises working-class and women, popularity of Jesus in some circles. Barriers to join: Viewed as crazy, suffer needling from more popular Jewish religious leaders. Non-Jews would not have heard of it.

2. 45-65 CE: Christianity now has more and more non-Jews, and these non-Jews are not required to follow Jewish rules like dietary rules or circumcision. For non-Jews, it has the advantage of a monotheism that is more in line with the current philosophical fad (neo-Platonism) with an ancient history (Judaism) without actually becoming Jewish. Barriers: Race relations between Jewish and non-Jewish factions are rocky, and you're viewed as crazy by your Pagan neighbors. Government asks uncomfortable questions when you don't show up to Emperor Worship ceremonies. It really gets hard when you're drafted into the Roman army and you say fighting is against your religion.

3. 65-120 CE: Most of the time, Romans are feeding you to lions or burning you as tiki torches for Nero's banquets. The bravery of those who died before you is inspiring, but it's hardly an easy choice. Must meet in secret, and every now and then, you find out a close friend is actually an agent that turns you all in.

4. 120-290 CE: It goes back and forth. Most of the time you're not being fed to lions, but everyone you know still thinks you're weird. You still get in trouble for being a pacifist and not worshiping the emperor, but often the Empire has more pressing concerns than to beat up on you.

5. 290-312 CE: Back to the bad old days of executions. By this time people had gotten soft and crack under pressure. Some bishops turn in the names of their congregants to get off easy.

6. 312-370 CE: The emperor Constantine has converted to Christianity. It's now in style to be Christian. You don't even have to know anything about it--just get some water poured on you and you get preferential treatment for high government posts.

7. 370-1700s CE: Christianity is the only legal religion in the Roman empire. Therefore, by definition, everyone is Christian, like it or not. The term "Christian" comes to mean "any old bloke".
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