Yet Another Nit-picking Question...

It's not MAD science...just disappointed.

Moderator: Gav

Postby Gav on Wed Mar 22, 2000 5:50 am

Actually, I <B>love</B> that you're being so nitpicky. I put a lot of thought into making this thing scientifically accurate and it's nice to see that people notice.<P>Sometimes I'm just talking out of my ass and making up stuff to fit plot points, but this time I went to the Greenpeace website first to look up some info (and pictures) of their ship, the "Rainbow Warrior." Technically, it <B>should</B> be called the "Rainbow Warrior II" because the French sunk their first ship with a torpedo when they weren't going to move out of the way of a undersea nuclear test.<P>The Rainbow Warrior is a "Motor Assisted Schooner" with a maximum speed of 12 knots, but an "economical speed" of 8 knots. It can also sail under wind power at 5-7 knots (this seems REALLY slow to me... What's the conversion to MPH?). See <A HREF="http://www.greenpeace.org/~toxics/toxfreeasia/warrior.html" TARGET=_blank>http://www.greenpeace.org/~toxics/toxfreeasia/warrior.html</A> for more info.<P>"Peak" efficiency is really just wind power, and you can probably just assume that's what he meant. I don't know much about sailing, though. I can't imagine it would do any good to use sails and a motor at the same time. Maybe someone else can answer that. I would imagine that, in practice, Greenpeace is just as impatient about "making good time" as the rest of us, and when you absolutely have to be at that protest on time, fuel be damned.
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Postby Wafath on Wed Mar 22, 2000 7:55 am

So the Greenpeace ship is a sailboat, or a combination diesel/sail powered ship. If they are running a peak efficiency, they are going to be fully sail powered. How is a closed nuclear cycle going to get more efficient than that?<P>Last I heard you don't have to refuel sailboats...<P>(Damn it... I am only asking such questions because he is an engineer... I don't have these expectations of anyone else.)<P>W
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Postby ragnarok on Thu Mar 23, 2000 1:34 am

First of all, 1 knot = 1.15 mph, so yeah that's pretty slow. But for a sailing ship 10-12 knots is very fast.<P>Also, sailing and motoring at the same time can be useful in light winds, it's called (oddly enough) motor-sailing. The wind still provides some force even though you're also moving the boat with the engine, so it's more efficient than motoring, faster than sailing alone.
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Postby Wafath on Thu Mar 23, 2000 9:25 am

<BLOCKQUOTE><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by Gav:
<I>Actually, I <B>love</B> that you're being so nitpicky. I put a lot of thought into making this thing scientifically accurate and it's nice to see that people notice.</I><HR></BLOCKQUOTE><P>Happy to oblige. I think.<P> <BLOCKQUOTE><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><HR><I>"Peak" efficiency is really just wind power, and you can probably just assume that's what he meant. I don't know much about sailing, though. I can't imagine it would do any good to use sails and a motor at the same time. Maybe someone else can answer that. I would imagine that, in practice, Greenpeace is just as impatient about "making good time" as the rest of us, and when you absolutely have to be at that protest on time, fuel be damned.
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</I><HR></BLOCKQUOTE><P>"Fuel be damned" isn't environmentally friendly. Also... well at 8 knots they use 1800 l/day. So they use 1800 l/192 knot = 9.375 l/knot. I don't know how much fuel they can store on board, but if the 40 days range (from their web page) is fuel limited (and not food limited) they can store as much as 72000 l on board. That is a lot of fuel.<P>On the other hand they list the net tonnage as being 166 tons. 72000 l diesel ~= 72 tonnes. so... maybe.<P>I think tho that they would still try and sail as much as possible, saving fuel for emergencies and for harbors. If nothing else Greenpeace does not have infinite financial resources, and 1800l diesel ain
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