I have an idea

The only gaming webcomic that's 100% Jack Thompson joke free!

Moderators: Mike Rosenzweig, Braidboy, Shiroi Kaze

I have an idea

Postby Enigma316 on Fri Nov 21, 2008 3:25 pm

I dont know if anyone has already suggested this, so if they have you can lock this.

Ive been a reader of GodMode for a while now, I absolutely loved Raven and Ryans work on it, but I, as many have been seriously disaspointed with Adis work here on GodMode. After seeing this post http://forums.keenspot.com/viewtopic.php?f=101&t=103346 it got me thinking, why dosen't someone release their own version of God Mode here on KeenSpot or something. Call it GodMode: Reloaded or something with the re- suffix. This version would start where Raven finished off like maybe the first page would be Barrett finally proposing to Tory. I dont know bout any of you but I really wanted to see that ^^.

So what do u all think lol
Enigma316
Junior Keenspotter
 
Posts: 3
Joined: Fri Nov 21, 2008 3:18 pm

Re: I have an idea

Postby Alexiedennison on Tue Jan 20, 2009 8:07 pm

Wow, that would be okay, But wouldnt that cause a rift?
And seriously. we dont own the characters so how would we pull it off...
they might SUE us for stealing their ideas?

They best thing to do...is smile...nod...Gritt your teeth and wait for the artist to get the idea already and PISS OFF!
Seriously...
I didnt waste nearly all my download limit reading this awesome comic to see it FAIL and go down...THE CRAPPER!
Alexiedennison
Junior Keenspotter
 
Posts: 1
Joined: Tue Jan 20, 2009 7:54 pm

Re: I have an idea

Postby Chris Crosby on Thu Mar 05, 2009 11:08 am

Yes, we would sue you, don't do that.

If you want to draw GOD MODE, E-Mail me at keenspot@keenspot.com with samples of your work and we will consider you. I think Adis is doing a good job but he won't be doing the strip forever. Like DOCTOR WHO, I want to "regenerate" the strip with a new artist/writer every so often to keep it fresh.
User avatar
Chris Crosby
KeenAdmin
 
Posts: 3994
Joined: Wed Mar 08, 2000 12:00 am
Location: Cresbard, SD, USA

Re: I have an idea

Postby muzzle on Thu Mar 05, 2009 8:52 pm

As an artist, and one trying to start two webcomics, I have little experience at this, but I've learned something: you have to cater to the audience. If you think Adis is funny, fine, but without your audience, you have no where to go. Negative word of mouth has a way of getting around faster than positive. I'm not trying to sound like I'm making a threat, but this comic has lost a lot of its fan base since Adis started doing it, and all I've read from the Admins, such as Mr. Crosby, is how they think Adis is funny, while almost every fan of the comic thinks he isn't.

Honestly, I'm losing my faith, not just in GodMode, but in Keenspot. Once I get one of my comics started on the internet, I doubt I'll even try to get endorsed (or however one gets on Keenspot) by them.

Keenspot should be happy that their fans are voicing their opinion, no matter if its negative or not. Its the feedback that helps improve the comic. And the feedback for Adis' GodMode has been negative, and it seems to me that its being ignored. Feel free to explain to me if I'm wrong, but if I'm not (and think deep down about this), how is it going to improve in that case?
muzzle
Junior Keenspotter
 
Posts: 7
Joined: Sat Oct 04, 2008 5:07 pm

Re: I have an idea

Postby Braidboy on Fri Mar 06, 2009 1:27 am

I'm not going to speak for Chris, but I'm going to speak from my experience on the strip saying that feedback is NOT ignored. When Kerns was doing the sequence where the Godmode cast was in the fighting tournament...it got reigned in. When I was going off track with the "manhood test" sequence he let me know. Fan complaints DO go noticed.

Also this forum has always been allowed to get as negative as people like. heh heh. When kerns was dealing with all that trolling he had the power to ban people and lock threads, but he'd just post back and forth with them. I've never been afraid to let complaints roll on in. And similarly Adis' run has allowed complaints to stand.

I think then that it should be noted that there are those unspoken folks who are simply enjoying the strip. And trust me... If there aren't enough of them, Crosby sends you notice to kinda change up what you're doing and get back to what's working. So just know that if Crosby's happy then there MUST be a significant traffic flow to back that up.

It's just tough when a comic you like goes through changes. I mean if you liked it the way it was. Just remember that you may be unhappy with the strip as it is now, but others may be enjoying more than ever.
User avatar
Braidboy
Keenspotter Supreme
 
Posts: 193
Joined: Sun Mar 19, 2006 10:58 pm
Location: WV

Re: I have an idea

Postby muzzle on Fri Mar 06, 2009 8:34 pm

I'm glad to see that someone (or a few) people do appreciate the feedback, positive or negative. But, its not just GodMode that I've noticed this with. The change of artist/writer in GodMode just makes it the prominent example (at least in my eyes).

As a good example, I refer you to D.C. Simpson retiring from "Ozy & Millie" when she felt that her heart wasn't in it anymore. She did some soul searching, and decided to end the strip "the way it should be ended," instead of letting it go bad. And while the later strips (save for the last few which were excellent and charming) weren't up to par, in my opinion, they were still worthy of being in O&M.

But, I've also seen drastic changes in Bobby Crosby's comic, "+EV," in which Corbin seems to get mad at everything (http://plusev.keenspot.com/d/20090118.html) or irritate everyone (http://plusev.keenspot.com/d/20090125.html). He also seems less of a family man (though that wasn't his emphasis anyway), and more self absorbed than he originally was. I understand characters change over time, but this change seemed to have happened inexplicably. Of course, I may be reading into it wrong, but this is what I'm getting from it.

Another strip that seems to be lacking is "No Pink Ponies." I understand people have personal issues (as I do myself, as does EVERYONE), but going three to six months without an update or without news on why there are no updates, to put it bluntly, seems like a big middle finger to the readers. Again, I understand personal issues do arise. I've had to hold off on doing my comic on deviant art because of school, work, and some relationship issues. But, I do let my few readers know what's going on.

You're probably right on some people quietly enjoying this comic the way it is, but you may need to account for who those people are, as well. They may be Adis' fans from his other comics, who see this as another one of his works. Or it may be people who are new to it. If that's there sense of humor, I'm not going to chastise them for it. They're entitled to their opinions. And I have no way of checking the page views on this comic, so I'm not going to try to disprove you. I will say this, though. As a fan of GodMode since when it started, I can't even adjust to Adis' work, nor does it seem most of the posters on this forum can. While every artist has their own style (no one can tell me that Greg Capullo's and Jim Lee's work are alike with a straight face), the change seems to much, too fast.

I do appreciate the respectful reply. If I seem like I'm coming off as a jerk, that is not my intention. But, I just want to express how it looks from the readers' viewpoint. And with most, if not all of the Keenspot workers saying "He's doing a good job," and we have no way to see the views (nor the opinions of silent readers) some of us feel like that we're being ignored, or just pushed to the side. It's good to know that someone is listening (or reading in this case), and I thank you for that.
muzzle
Junior Keenspotter
 
Posts: 7
Joined: Sat Oct 04, 2008 5:07 pm

Re: I have an idea

Postby CapnWellpoint on Sat Mar 07, 2009 9:14 pm

I understand why one artist would reserve his criticism towards one of his own. As it stands, Raven and Adis are not exactly juggernauts of the online comic world - hardly anybody can make such a claim. As such, it becomes socially undesirable to be hyper-agressive towards the lacking work of a peer, lest that peer's situation become one's own. I get it: the life of an artists is often hard and thankless, but I don't think that the hardships are completely unique to artists. Each and every moment of every day, somebody is cut down by the competition, irregadless of who they are, what they've done in the past, or of the purity of their heart. The banking situation has hurt my friend, for example. He has just one more year to go to finish college, but he can't get a loan to do it right now. Unfortunately, he hasn't been a phenomenal student, just like Adis hasn't been a phenomenal comic writer here. My buddy has been at least passing his necessary classes, though, and if they cut him off now then he's been wasting years of time, thousands of dollars in tuition, and is now stuck several months behind his rent payments. In my opinion, my friend is a great guy, and he's quite popular with no small margin of people, but he's placed himself in this situation by doing a sub-par job in his school work, and my question is: if he's going to be stopped here when he's so close to his current life's goal, what makes Adis so damn special that he can produce bottom-rung entertainment and still catch a break?

The reason why I turn my television on every day only to immediately shut it off again is because of stuff like ratings. Maybe Adis brings in enough traffic to make profit and he's therefore a safe investment, but I feel very strongly that his work is dry and tasteless. On top of releasing work that barely contains a flicker of humor in most cases, his update scheduling is poor at best. I admit that keeping up with the crappy video games that have been released lately is hard - though frankly unnecessary to making a comic with personality - and that I certainly couldn't be bothered to do it, but I also admit that's why I don't keep up with all the crappy video game releases. If you can't do it, then don't. Do something else! Yes, I see that copy/paste fat kid hung a poster of the girl from FEAR on his wall. Alright, it's very cute that he has a crush on her, yes, but you executed the joke like a pair of concrete shoes.

"I'm Adrian Ramos, and I play video games."

Holy Hell.

"I'm Freddy from Scooby Doo Mysteries, and look gang, there's a door!"

Thank you Freddy from Scooby Doo Mysteries. Jinkies, we all see the door. It wasn't even a secret door.
CapnWellpoint
Junior Keenspotter
 
Posts: 12
Joined: Sun Oct 05, 2008 5:21 pm

Re: I have an idea

Postby Braidboy on Sun Mar 08, 2009 9:44 am

As a comic changes artists(writers...both) a split in the readership is normal. Some fans leave because the changes are just more than they can accept. Others stay because they hope they will adjust to the change. Others leave temporarily, but keep their eye out for artist changes so they can jump back into the comic. But what you HOPE is that the change will be beneficial. Sometimes the change may be out of your control...

Kerns left because his heart was leaning towards photography more than comics. He told me he's been so happy with the success of his photography he's hardly drawn let alone thought of comics.

I left because I felt I was doing more damage than good. Negative feedback online is important since most of these folks don't care to let loose and rip you a new one... but sometimes it's tough to discern what is genuine and what is the excessive negativity associated with the internet. It was a mix of that...And I have many honest friends in real life who were telling me I was doing sub par work. So I stepped out of the way. In truth my heart was leaning towards projects of my own and that was probably effecting my work.

Now Godmode is an intimidating strip. I already mentioned that there is a stigma. So stepping into that role was daunting. I am not aggressively critical for two reasons. I have been there... it's a tough role to fill. Plus I kinda like what he's doing. The change is probably good since this strip needs something fresh. Is it what I was doing? Nah. But we're just different guys. As an artist I respect all other artists.

Returning to the mainstream comics thing... After the split in time things stable out. Readers that just can't take it, leave and go silent. Fans that DO like it begin to feel more comfortable showing their approval without fear of having their opinion criticized. In the end you have a comic with (hopefully) an improvement in readership. I mean in both prior cases the artist left because of their own reasons, so these changes weren't made to increase readership, but out of necessity. However, I don't think Adis is doing so badly that Crosby really needs to laydown the law. I mean, the readership must be satisfactory or better.

So at the end of the day you're back to the choice being yours as the reader. You can move on. Hang in and adjust. Or wait for the next guy. Crosby has even said that he's open to submissions from artists that are interested in taking the reigns once Adis feels he wants to move on. So by all means, step in! Submit. I hang in there because I dig Godmode. I kinda dig the more wholesome strips Adis is doing. Plus I just wanna see this damn comic do well. I like these characters.
User avatar
Braidboy
Keenspotter Supreme
 
Posts: 193
Joined: Sun Mar 19, 2006 10:58 pm
Location: WV

Re: I have an idea

Postby muzzle on Sun Mar 08, 2009 12:27 pm

I can agree that, yes, it is hard to take over an established strip. It's hard to create one as well. I'm using my Deviant Art page (http://thewindowkeeper.deviantart.com/) as proof of this, not as a submission to take over GodMode. My web comic, "Muzzle" is off to a rough start, but I took what people said, and I'm working with it. Its not the funniest strip (some of them I'll admit, suck, but I'm my own harshest critic) but its one that's personal to me, and I'm willing to change it to make it better. And that's what I feel that, not just Adis, but Saiful Remy Mokhtar, Bobby Crosby, and the team who does Menage A 3, have to keep in mind (again, me not having a way to check how many page views any of these comics get does put me at the handicap of not having all of the information to make a judgement of "failure" or "success"): Change the strip, adapt to what the strip started off as, or quit (or take a break, but let fans know about it). And in my opinion, I don't see how Adis' version of GodMode is wholesome, my main example being the "Left 4 Dead" strip, but it may also be because I'm sick of "Poo" jokes. I see enough of those on TV as it is.

What got me into GodMode was the innovation of the storylines (personally, I loved the "Man Test" one), and with Adis taking over, I feel that the innovation is lost, not to mention the sporadic, at best, update schedule is, as well, a turn off. And yes, a change in artist will usually cause a rift with fans. As a mainstream example, Brian Haberline took over "Spawn," and made it more realistic and gritty. Personally, I loved the change, but when he quit due to his wife giving birth, and he wanted more family time (something I can fully respect and understand), Todd McFarland took over his own creation, only knowing certain things about the continuity (while a lot, it still wasn't everything), and ruined it by killing the main character. While GodMode hasn't done anything that drastic, its the best example I can think off, because while now I'm against "Spawn," (and most mainstream comics, as well), there are still a lot of fans who have and haven't voiced there opinions who do enjoy the strip. And, just like those who like the change of pace here, I'm not going to say they're wrong, because everyone has there own opinions.

Again, the link above is not for consideration, but as an example of how a comic, web or not, may need to change (if absolutely needed). Even if I was considered to do GodMode, I'd have to turn it down due to my school, work, and trying to start both a humorous web comic, and a horror web comic. My updates for a third would be horrible, and I doubt with that, and the fact that I'm still trying to find my humor voice (my horror comic, "Goria," has an almost perfect tone in writing for what it is). Personally, I feel I may do the comic even less justice than Adis, or any other artist, has or will do.
muzzle
Junior Keenspotter
 
Posts: 7
Joined: Sat Oct 04, 2008 5:07 pm

Re: I have an idea

Postby Braidboy on Sun Mar 08, 2009 2:42 pm

I'm glad I followed the link on through to your DA account. You know you seem to have just hit on a bad run with the books you've been reading. Me and a pal were talking about how we hear people complaining that "there are no good comics" anymore when in reality there are MANY good comics. They just don't get the limelight they deserve. Your list of mainstream comics that have really disappointed lately I can totally agree with. However, try switching gears. You'll find there are many creators who are passionate and dedicated to their characters. Like The Goon, Savage Dragon, Invincible, Walking Dead, Scott Pilgrim. Granted these books may not all fit the bill, but they're a good example of what comics ought to be.

Anyway we all hit that point where we get fed up. It's a good reaction to want to create comics because you don't feel what you want is really out there. That's actually the best reason. Unlike doing something derivative maybe you'll really hit on something unique.

Uh that might be off topic, but maybe not as much as ya think. I just think that if something bugs you then it's okay to abandon it and seek something that doesn't. Or even better create something that fills that void you perceive.
User avatar
Braidboy
Keenspotter Supreme
 
Posts: 193
Joined: Sun Mar 19, 2006 10:58 pm
Location: WV

Re: I have an idea

Postby muzzle on Sun Mar 08, 2009 5:24 pm

I can see where you're going with the bad run. Most of the mainstream comics I've liked have been blasted a lot lately, while others are merely a footnote in comic history. Aside from "Spawn," "Spider-Man" has the main character selling his soul to "divorce" his wife and save his aunt, thereby destroying the past continuity, and ruining the character. DC killed Batman in "Final Crisis," and came up with a convoluted story to start his downfall ("Batman R.I.P.") that ultimately alienated a lot of fans. Other comics I've loved, "The Maxx" and "Creech" are no longer made, and "Walking Dead", while good at first, seemed to fade in quality, or I grew out of it. But, as of late, most comics seemed to hit more of a political stance, and less of a "superhero" stance that I grew up with.

To put this in perspective, I got into reading comics at a very young age, and I got into some of my own characters when I was in the sixth grade. The characters that have stayed in my mind to work with(except for "Muzzle" which is only two years old from conception until now) have been with me for thirteen years. I would have had sites for them earlier, but after high school, I enlisted in the army, and I'm just now getting the equipment to polish a site, as well as my art. The timing of it does seem like that I'm doing this because I'm "fed up," which is partly right, but I'm also attempting this because I was inspired by the comics that I've read before, and the classics that I still love ("Batman: Arkham Asylum" and "Watchmen" to name some). I will admit, there are a lot of comics I haven't read, and there are a lot that are still good, even if they don't fit my taste. But again, I'm a little off topic, here.

While some may see what I'm doing as abandoning what I used to love, I don't personally say that. I see it as a change of gears, and one that's most logical for me. A lot of people don't get my humor (which, again, I can relate with Adis on that), or they may think that making a horror comic the way I'm doing it is too horrific. Making the hero essentially a monster has rarely been done before, and I understand why people would stay away from it as well. On top of that, there are a lot of webcomics coming almost everyday, which adds stiff competition not just for upstarts (as myself) but also for established webcomics, especially after a change of writers, and one as controversial as this. Or even one with awkward updates. And again, about that, I don't think I'd be much better with three different ideas, especially one that isn't my own. Again, while yes, I'm personally not a fan of the change in GodMode, I don't want to be like a lot of people who are overly aggressive, and in some cases, just rude about it, because I can understand the situation Adis is in.

On a last note, I'd like to thank you for looking at my DA page. There are a lot of websites and admins a like that would completely ignore it and move on.
muzzle
Junior Keenspotter
 
Posts: 7
Joined: Sat Oct 04, 2008 5:07 pm

Re: I have an idea

Postby Braidboy on Mon Mar 09, 2009 8:51 am

I think the issue comes from the fact that the most visible form of fan opinion (this forum) seems to reflect a mostly negative view while the invisible fan opinion (site traffic) is unknown to fans. I'm not saying you need to know that. ha ha. That's just a numbers game and they always fluctuate for whatever reason (the week of the duke nukem/halo strip this site was winning over hearts and even topped penny arcade on a fan poll of webcomics for the week...afterwards...not so much. heh heh). But what I AM saying is it can be tough to perceive the support that is there when you and most everyone you are able to get an opinion from feels differently than what's currently being done.

I'll use music for an example. I haven't bought a cd in YEARS. Maybe 8? It's been a long time. I've been doing mp3s since before apple made ipods. So as soon as I didn't HAVE to buy a whole cd for one song(or even a few) I didn't. And life to me was MUCH better. Mp3s allowed me to have a ton of music that never got damaged, lost, stolen. Never skipped. I couldn't see the reason why anyone would buy CDs! And well... Most everyone I know feels the same way! They may not have ipods, but they have some form of mp3 player that they use for music. So why does the music industry still make cds?! There's money in it. There's support. Enough to make it profitable. And yeah, sooner or later everything will go the digital distribution way. But it's amazing to me it's taking this long! That's just because although I was exposed to what I felt was a majority opinion that cds were obsolete a significant portion of the music enjoying population felt otherwise. And that's pretty much it in a nut shell.

To use a more comic based example: Crossovers. I hate them. You hate them. I don't know anyone who just loves the thought that they'll have to get 52 issues to figure out what the hells going on in the story (DC... I'm looking at you...). And yet, they continue to pump them out. One after another. Why? Well the damn things must be worth it. They must be winning over fans. And hey, I'm cool with that. I just retreat to my fave books. They're not winning ME over, but they're quite pleasing to more fans than myself.

It's just that there's support there that you're not necessarily aware of otherwise Crosby would be all over it. Trust me. He watches out for the well being of this strip.

Another pain of the internet (the world really) is that criticism flows easier than praise. Lending itself to creating that visible form of negative opinion while masking the true support. I've been making comics for a long time online. I'm no juggernaut, but I'll tell you that I know enough to know that you can be kicking ass... And not hear a peep. It's when you fuck up that people let you have it. ha ha. And those folks are usually more vocal.

I dunno... I feel like I'm meandering a bit with what I'm saying, but I feel that's kinda relevant to post about as well.
User avatar
Braidboy
Keenspotter Supreme
 
Posts: 193
Joined: Sun Mar 19, 2006 10:58 pm
Location: WV

 

Return to God Mode

Who is online

Users browsing this forum: No registered users and 2 guests